Team 114 Kien Tuong

MACV Team 114- Kien Tuong.

This Page is intended for the discussion of the Military Assistance Command Vietnam Team 114 located in Kien Tuong.

258 thoughts on “Team 114 Kien Tuong

  1. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all my fellow Veterans from Moc Hoa, MACV Team 85, B-41 5th SFGA, and nearby installations and outfits. I just learned that the commies renamed the town of Moc Hoa to Kien Tuong when they absorbed Kien Tuong Province into Long An in 1976.

    • FYI,

      A number of years ago I was looking for Ap Bac Chan using Google Map.

      I saw then that Moc Hoa had been renamed to Kien Tuong.

      It looks like Ap Bac Chan was renamed Ap Binh Chau!

      Oh well..

      A life time ago….

      A. LeCault 67-68.


      • Andre, my son visited Ap Bac a few years ago and he sent me photos of the town. It’s nothing like you and I would remember. The old French Counting house that was used as the District Headquarters is now a large school. The old rickity bridge is now a massive modern span and the roads are paved. The old Ap Bac battlefield is now a ‘natiopnal monument’ complete with the wreckage of an APC and a downed chopper. It was one of the mandatory stops for my son that his guide was required to make. They stayed in a nice hotel in town along the canal and ate at a nice resturaunt. He said that he was warmly welcomed. They even located an old man who had worked for the American advisors but his memor was shot and he really couldn’t tell Pat (my son) much except that he showed him a spot along the canal where he remembered helping a young officer who had an accident in the water. (probable me) In one of the photos of the school it does look like they may have kept that gate house. If it’s the same one we used to ‘sunbathe’ up there and have drinks up there when the weather was good. But I couldn’t recognize much else. Yes my brother, things have definitely changed in the past 50+ years.

  2. Hope that all of my teammates out there have a wonderful Thanksgiving.
    Pete ‘Hardcharger’ Taylor
    Ap Bac 1969-1970, Moc Ho 1970-1971

  3. FYI my newest novel about my time as the Province Senior Intelligence Advisor at Moc Hoa has gone live and is now available on Amazon. I hope that I’ve done Team-85 justice with the effort. I tried to change names in most cases just in case! This is the sequel to my novel about Ap Bac and my time on th team there.

      • Jeff,

        I didn’t get up to Moc Hoa from Ap Bac until 1970 and by then the SF team was pretty much out of ther. IIRC we still had a CIDG element at Tuyen Nhon but that was being withdrawn and turned over to the ARVN by the time I took over as the Province S-2 with MACV-85. I moved to Ap Bac in late 1969 and by then the SF teams had been withdrawn. I don’t recall ever meeting Wes Herrlein, By the time I got there MACV-85 was the only game in town. IIRC I replaced 1LT Norris as the S-2. Dids you by any chance know Captain Tommy Eggers? He was SF and for some reason ended up on the MACV team while I was ther.


        • Pete,
          I was in high-school till 69. My dad was at Group S2 as a CIC Tech after he spent a couple of months with B55. See TWS COL Leo J Meyer

          I have read on MACV Teams about Wes Wes was a good friend of my dad’s. He worked with my dad at Ft Dix and my sister and I babysat for his daughter, Kay.

          I saw Wes at Andrews AFB Evac Hospital in 69 and he told me (and my girlfriend) how (on the mission he was injured) it happened. They were getting ready to board the chopper in the LZ. He told everyone not to pick up anything put on the ground. A WO didn’t listen and when he lifted the item he disappeared. Wes stuck his fingers in the holes in his abdomen and sat on the chopper floor and when all remaining were loaded they left. (no bullet through the neck.) As a 19 year old this impressed me. His award doesn’t read that way for reasons.


          • Jeff,

            In 1969 I was in Vietnam up along the Cambodian border and then down at Ap Bac south of Hoc Hoa. I believe that teh incident that you are refering to happened before I got there. However, I can remember my old Sergeant, Fred Hartwick reminding me not to pick up the obvious. It was probably a booby-trap. I went through my Advanced Infantry training at Fort Dix, and the training there was terrible. A lot of the guys that I graduated with were sent straight over to Vietnam after AIT and they had a very high casualty rate. It was so bad tha eventually there was a congressional investigation of the training that was going on there. Thanks for the information on this site. I’m sure that someone out there knew Wes Herrlein and they will be interested in your story.

            As far as my two books are concerned, they are both novels. While the ‘war stories’ are actual events that took place while I was on Team-85 I presented them as a novel rather than history. I’m a military historian by training and I don’t have anything to back up these stories other than memories. Remember that there isn’t much of a difference between a war story and a fairytale. A fairytale starts out Once Upon A Tme and a War Story starts …There we Were! LOL. Regards, Pete “Hardcharger” Taylor

      • BTY I finally got in touch with Captain Sergeant. Dean was the S-1 at Moc Hoa during my second tour 1970-1971. It was great making contact with him. I sent him a number of photos that I had from our time together in Vietnam. Dean retired from his legal practice a few years ago and is living in the Northwestern US. Still trying to locate Tommy Eggers.

        Second novel about my time in Ap Bac is out on Amazon. Hope all of you enjoy it!

        Pete “Hardcharger” Taylor

  4. Attn: Pete Taylor: I was the Phuong Hoang advisor at Ap Bac- Feb-Dec 1969. Dai-uy Wetherell and I called in the airstrike at Base Are 470- that Maj Hamrick accompanied in a O-1A Bird dog. Following the bombing mission – Ken Hamrick crashed – just S or our chopper pad. Please contact me,,as Dai-uy Mop and I were close. I spoke at his large funeral in Putnam ct. ca 2016.

    • Len it’s great to hear from you. We both served together at Ap Bac. When Captain Wetherell left I believe that they sent you down there temporarily as his replacement. In fact I’ve got a couple of neat photos of you. My e-mail is I heard that Captain Wetherell passed away a few years ago. I was trying to locate his widow and relay my condollances. I ended up going up to the Province team in 1970 as the S-2 and left there in April 1971

    • Len, would like to hear back from you. I’ve got some photos of you, one of which is you and Ina Balin during her visit to Ap Bac and a couple of others that you might like to see. Drop me an email if you get a chance. Additionally there are a couple pf people interested in information regarding Major Hamrick. Of course that happened before I got there and you might be able to provide them some information. Also I’ve written an novel “The Advisor: Kien Bing, South Vietnam 1969-1970 available on Amazon that you might enjoy. Changed a lot of names and place names, but it’s basicall a fictionalized story of Ap Bac that you might enjoy – just remember that it’s fiction LOL! Thieu uy Taylor

    • Len, hope that you get back to me ASAP. I’ve got a wonderful ‘report’ from one of the guys that you might have replaced at Ap Bac, Andre LeCault. He was assigned to the MAT team there prior to MACV taking over. Also, the second book “The Province Senior Intelligence Advisor is on Amazon. Get back to me if you will. I’d love to talk to you and share some photos.

  5. On this Memorial Day 2022, I remember Captain George P. “Pat” O’Toole, CO of A-411, KIA in December 1967 (Silver Star). I also remember SGT Bill Baer, the medic at A-414, KIA in May 1968 and who also earned a Silver Star. Finally, I remember SFC Margarito “Chico” Fernandez, of B-41, who lost his life in March 1969. May they rest in peace in the company of good men.

  6. I had a wonderful meeting with a former MACV Team 85 member, Rusty Hobbs out in California. We reminisced about our times on the team. He arrived there shortly after I left in April 1971, but we had a lot of mutual associates. Rusty worked in the admin shop and then went to the TOC and then cross trained as a combat medic. Swapped a lot of interesting ‘war stories’. I gave him an autographed copy of my first book “The Advisor” and also forwarded him a copy of my second book “The Province Senior Intelligence Advisor” which I hope to have out sometime this fall. Rusty and I have talked a number of times since then over the phone.

    I’m trying to get in touch with one of the S-1 staff officers, Dean Sergeant, I believe that he is in Washington State. I’ve also been looking for another guy, Captain Tommy Eggers. Tommy was one of the operations guys back in 1971-72. Tommy had been a SF officer assigned to the B-41 team during his first tour in Moc Hoa.

    Take care my Brothers!

    • Pete,

      Were you at Ap Bac when Ken Hamrick crashed on 14 Aug 69? Wondering if we ever spoke on Fox Mike during my tour as Bomber 32, AF FAC, Kien Toung Province, Aug 69- Apr 70?


      Hope you and yours enjoying 2022!

      • Jim, I arrived there in September ’69. I was initially assigned to Long Khot as the S-2 Advisor and after the attack in Long Khot in December I was assigned to Ap Bac as the S-2/Phoenix Advisor with Captain Peter T. Weatherall. Based on your dates there we probably crossed paths in Moc Hoa. Pete “Hardcharger” Taylor

        • I did work with “Army” Adams who was out ‘Bird Dog” pilot and I’m sure that the two of you had contacts with one another.

      • Jim, Len Funk was at Ap Bac when Hamrick crashed. I’m trying to get in touch with him. Watch for some posts and perhaps the two of you can get together,

      • Jim, I wasn’t there but Captian Pete Wetherell and Lieutenant Len Funk were. I’m trying to get in touch with Len and reconnect with him. If I do I’ll try to have him get in touch with you. He might know the details. I got to Ap Bac in late 1969 and left there for the Province team in September 1970.


  7. To All My Brothers and Sisters out there. This is an announcement that my Book about my time at Ap Bac has been published online at Amazon as an e book (ASIN B09H3KX3D2). It will be available as a paperback and hardcover book in the near future. during the Covid ‘lockdown’ I was challenged by a good friend, a fellow veteran, to write down some of the stories that I remember from my time at Ap Bac in 1969-1970.

    As a writer I write military history. When I write I can document what I present from a variety of sources. ‘War Stories” on the other hand are just that ‘stories’. They are undocumented yet real to those of us who lived them. I tried to write in such a manner as to familiarize the non-Vietnam veteran with what we went through on the various teams. There are a few books on the Advisory effort, but most of the books on the war center around the divisional units.

    This is a “War Story” and a novel, it’s fiction, but I hope that it accurately portrays some of our activities out there on the small teams, what we went through and what we had to do to accomplish our mission. Since it’s a novel it had to have a built in ‘love story’ and I’ve tried to be thoughtful with that part of the novel – all of which is true fiction.

    I would appreciate your comments.

    Pete ‘Hardcharger’ Taylor
    Team 85 1969-1971

    • Pete, Looking forward to your narrative. What is the name of your book? I tried “ASIN B09H3KX3D2) and did not get anywhere.
      Andre LeCault, MAT 62/85 AP Bac Chan 67-68

      • Andre, “The Advisor”, now in all three modes, e-book, paperback and hard copy
        I hope that you enjoy the story.. Needless to say it is a work of fiction so names have been changed to protect the guilty/innocents. The WAC Captain that I mentioned was real – I met her a Fort Holabird and we were good friends. The rest of the romantic side of the story, well, the girl was real but we never dated. She was in her late 20’s and I was a 20-year old 2LT. But when I started writing this a friend of mine, a published author, indicated that I needed the ‘love angle’ to sell any books. The guys might enjoy the ‘war stories’ but it is the women that buy the fiction. I already have a second book about serving at Moc Hoa at the Province team in ‘the can’ and a third book about my final tour there with 525 MI Group at the end in March of 1973. I am also working on a forth book that is is a compilations of stories that just wouldn’t fit into any of the books.

        • Hi Pete! I’m looking forward to reading your book. I was trained as an Intel Analyst (96B) at Ft. Holabird in 1967. When I got to Vietnam, a buddy and I were at the 525th MI in Saigon and, when they found out he had experience as a bartender, they kept him there, while I got sent out to the SF camp at Moc Hoa.

    • Pete, just bought the Kindle version of your book and I am really looking forward to reading it. I just started rereading”The Rise and Fall of Third Reich”. I may not be able to start your book until 2022. I really am impressed that you are a published author. I hope the advances and royalties make you rich.

      • Thanks Kevin, I hope that you enjoy the book. I beat my way through “The Rise and Fall” back in college for a WWII history course that I took. Also try “The Rising Sun by John Toland regarding Japan and WWII Both excellent reads.

    • I just ordered your book – paperback. Looking forward to reading. I’ve posted here in the past, but I cannot remember who all wrote back. My Dad was LTC Wes Herrlein. 5th SF group. He did 2 tours. I’ll have to check my dates, but I believe he was wounded in ’72 (2nd tour). Did you happen to know him? I’ve heard really great things, Ive also heard he was a “prick” LOL. I’m sure there was some of both!

      • I was halfway through my time in Moc Hoa when your Dad took command at B-41. I got along with him very well, and as far as I can recall, he was highly regarded by the troops he commanded. I was sad to learn that he was wounded soon after I left, and even more so to learn of his passing.

    • Comrades in Arms: While doing some research on my book I found the obituary of Colonel Robert Springman. He was the Province Senior Advisor after the departure of Colonel Terrell. He was a wonderful commander, and I owed my assignment to the Province Team as the Province Senior Intelligence Advisor to the Colonel.

      Robert W. Springman (Col. Retired – US Army,) age 87, passed away at home in his sleep on October 1, 2018

    • The Book got a really good review. Thought I’d share it with the group. If it was from one of my Comrades in Arms – Thanks


  8. Hello warriors,
    Thank you for your brave service. My name is Christian Torres. My father was with the 5th Special Forces Group (radio operator/crypto) and arrived in country to Moc Hoa in December 1966 – December 1967. His name was Sgt. GIlBERT TORRES. I have his ARCOM with Valor designation citation he earned after he and his colleagues contacted the Viiet Cong. That date of action on 11 May1967. I would greatly appreciate any information about him if you may have met him out there. Many blessing warriors. Thank you…

  9. For those that knew him, I found that Captain Peter T. Wetherell passed away from pancreatic cancer a few yeas ago. Pete was my boss at Ap Bac in 1969. Rest in Peace my Brother.

    • Thank you Pete. He was a good man. I will remember his in my prayers. So many have died at a young age. Kevin


    • I posted a reply to this comment that contained a picture of Captain Mike Burns and a link to his grave site. I’m curious why it was not posted by the MACV Teams admin.

      • Check the site guidelines.

        This website does not have the ability to post videos or photos. If you want to share videos or photos with others, it would be better to do it directly with them and not through this website.

        In order to protect those using this website from potential cyber harm, no post referring to or containing links to other sites will be permitted nor will posts coming from non personal (e.g. business) email addresses. If you want to share links with others, please do it directly with them and not through this website. The only exception is that personal email addresses are allowed.

      • I see MACV commented on their rules regarding photos. However, I would appreciate sending his photo to my email. Email :
        Thank you. I just found out what someone posted about using DD number and the National Archives has everyone that died in Nam with a DD number, but you must be a veteran or family member. I know that Mike’s parents are deceased and he had no siblings. So, I do not know if I can acquire information from the archives
        I would think I could, regardless if I am not related. Again, thank you very much. The Archives also remarked that Vietnam is still being researched as it is a complicated war and all information is appreciated.

  10. Hope that everyone had a very Merry Christmas and a Happy and safe new year. A guy asked me if I was afraid of this virus, I told him, “Hell I survived three combat tours in Vietnam and survived teaching high school for 17 years, After that Dude I ain’t afraid of nothing!” But please my brothers and sisters be careful and be safe out there! Hardcharger Two OUT

    • Hello Peter, I am inquiring about Captain Mike Burns. He died while assigned to the Kien Tuong Province, September 9, 1969. He started out at Fort Bragg, then he and my spouse assigned to DLI in Monterey, Calif. Both assigned to Okinawa with the First Special Forces and then assigned to the 5th Co D in Nam. I think that is all correct. Any and all information you may have is appreciated. I never found out formally what happened. I would like to know before I die. He was a good friend. We met when I was 19 years old and I was 21 years old when he died. He was 26 years old. Mike felt I was too young to be married, and that was a personal joke between us. So, much happened on Okinawa during 1969 and A teams were sent to Nam … some returned and others did not…it was always a wait and hold your breath period…I know Viet Nam impacted many people… I like your
      communication… very real, but made me smile. I hope to hear from you. Take Care…Covid is very real and deadly. You have the right attitude. My email is Maria

      • Maria, sorry I never had an opportunity to meet Mike. He died shortly before I arrived after completing my Officer Basic Course and Jungle Warfare School. When I arrived I was sent to the Phoenix School in Vung Tau and I really didn’t get back until mid-October and I was with the MACV Team. While I had some contact with the SF guys at B-41 most of my time was with the Advisory Team at Ap Bac. I hope that you are surviving this terrible disease and that you’ve managed to get your vaccinations. Pete Taylor

      • Maria, I was a UH-1C 114th AHC helicopter gunship crewchief and worked that mission . We were night flying around Chi Lang and were radioed to fly north to Muc Hoa . The incident happened just after mid-night as I recall. The 114th Slicks were pulling out some troops from Cambodia and the first helicopter was shot down and burned. Capt Burns was the only wounded American who perished (about a week later) . For some weird reason all the troops (and maybe the American flight crew) had to walk from Cambodia to South Viet Nam. We werent allowed to pick them up and flew all night guarding them. A pilot friend of mine wrote a story about this incident . Google dennis dupuis cambodia for his story . I am not the same Wilson as in Dennis’s story .

  11. I am researching a battle at Kien Tuong around 9/6/69 between Special Forces and Viet Cong where a good friend of mine died. His name is Michael Burns and he was 26 years old. I would like to know everything about this battle and Mike that I can find. A veteran emailed me saying I could check DD-214 …he did not explain what DD- 214 meant or where to check. I appreciate any help possible. I was living on Okinawa in 1969. Mike was a Captain assigned to the First Special Forces on Okinawa. Thank you for your help. Maria Hocker

    • I have a sheet of paper with all kinds of names on it. Given to me some years ago. Send me your email & will send to you.

  12. My cousin Private William Charles Moore Jr arrived in Vietnam on 27 November 1967. Bill jr was KIA on 21 December 1967 in Kien Tuong by gin, small arms fire or grenade. Bill jr was assigned to the 821st Supply Co – 277th S&S, 506 Field Depot. Army SPT CMD Saigon. 1st Log CMD, USARV. If anyone has any addition information about Bill jr KIA, please let me know. Sgt Henry F Moore

  13. Merry Christmas to all you veterans who served at Moc Hoa in the 60’s and 70’s, and to your families as well. I hope you’re all healthy and happy!

  14. I want to toss out a few names of people I remember from Moc Hoa in the 1967-69 range. If you have any information about them, would you kindly advise me? Thanks in advance…

    Lt. Jim O’Hara
    SSG John Darr
    SP5 Ross Bradley
    SP4 Tony Pappas
    SP4 John DeLuna
    SGM Henry Czerniak
    CPT Rod Savageau

  15. Master Sgt Robert Liddell, 37, Team 114 who was killed April 1, 1970 was recognized this Memorial Day at the Vietnam Veterans Memorial in Durango, about 35 miles from his hometown of Mancos.
    Eighteen deceased from SW Colorado had their name attached to a red rose placed at the memorial, an annual tradition.
    Sgt Liddell’s name was said aloud.
    Richard Ballantine
    Team 2 Quang Ngai

  16. On this date in 1969 I left Moc Hoa after 18 months service with Advisory Team #85. That year and a half was a critical time in my life and I wouldn’t change a thing about my time in the delta.

    • Hi Bruce,

      I left about 4-1/2 months later. President Nixon had started Vietnameseation of the conflict and ordered that all U.S. construction materials be set in place in Vietnam rather than transported back to the U.S. The U.S. Engineers decided to provide an asphalt layer on the existing laterite runway with “solid” steel planking on the 1,000 meter long Moc Hoa airfield.

      Our graduate Vietnamese Province Engineer, Do Dinh Phuc, (engineer graduate of University of Saigon) told me in French to please warn the American General that the water table was high in Kien Tuong Province and ground water evaporated through the existing airfield laterite; however, if Americans sealed this breathing surface with asphalt and provided “solid” steel planks, the moisture could not escape, and the earth below this new solid steel decking would turn into soft wet mud and could not support heavy U.S. Caribou Aircraft and C-130’s.

      This general told me this Vietnamese did not know what he was talking about and left.

      About (2) weeks after the last steel plank was installed by the American engineers, a C-130 arrived on the airfield. When it hit the airfield surface, the steel planks bent and the tremendous impact allowed the plane’s wheels to create about (12) continuous(6) feet diameter pot holes about (2) feet deep —– next, the steel planks rolled up and followed the C-130 like rolling up venetian blinds; sounded like an Atomic Bomb …. so the American engineers had to re-order steel planks.

      About two (2) months later in 1969, no fixed wing planes could land ….. only helicopters. The VC were trying to destroy as much of this airfield as they could sending in about (30) or so (80) MM mortar rounds every other night.

      Captain/Dr. John Goudelock and I were waiting on the airfield for a helicopter in late June or July to go to Hong Kong on R & R when we heard airplane popping sounds from way off and later saw a long trailing cloud of blue-black smoke. This Vietnamese pilot circled the airfield a few times to study the holes in the steel planking, and later came in like a snake on water dodging large airfield pot holes; however, he landed safely.

      With his engine running, popping, and smoking, he jumped out of his plane, walked up to us, saluted, and smiled with no teeth. He next walked over to a Vietnamese soldier to pick up a South Vietnamese Government envelope. I asked him in French where was he going …… he said Saigon. John and I did not bat an eye …… we both jumped in the back seat of his plane and left for Saigon …… we were commenting on the way it would be better to die in plane crash than get blown to pieces with the numerous VC mortar rounds coming in every night ….. we couldn’t talk much on the way sitting in an open cockpit with loud popping sounds and inhaling blue/black engine smoke.

      People wonder why combat veterans never tell war stories to non-veterans …… who would ever believe us!

      Thanks for reminding us when you left.


      • When I got there later in 1969 they had replaced the runway with a sort of interlocking aluminum plate. We warned the engineers about the water levels during the monsoons and of course they told us to pound sand. As the monsoons hit and the water rose so did the runway. Eventually the aluminum plates, which were hollow floated and pulled the stakes out. The runway floated! We had the Naval Intel Liaison Officer NILO living in our hut and as a joke we got him appointed on Team Orders as the airfield commander. By definition, written back in the 1920’s, an aircraft carrier was a “floating landing platform, capable of landing and taking off of aircraft”, so by definition Garry was the youngest, most junior-grade, aircraft carrier commander in the US Navy! It was a fun joke. Our Bird Dog could take off and land and Air America could come in as long as they didn’t actually “stop”. They would land and continuously turn around and we would jump off as it was moving and then when everyone was off the your repeat the process and pick up passengers, and then slowly taxi to the end of the runway and take off. As long as they kept shifting their weight on the individual plates they wouldn’t sink. We built a raised platform for the bird dog and that way it was above the runway and never rested on it until we were ready for our early morning and late evening VR flights. I left Moc Hoa in August 1971. I spent September ’69 – July ’70 at Ap Bac and Tuin Bien Districts in the southern part of the AO as a Phoenix Advisor and then went to Moc Hoa as the S-2 on my extensions.

    • I would like to talk with someone on MAT Team IV-114. Where exactly where you at in KienTuong? In 1967 I reported to SF LtCol Herrlein in Moc Hoa. I had been told there was an Advisory Team 85 but never met anyone from that team. Now I am becoming aware of MAT 114. I was with another MAT team, called MAT IV-62. In 1967, we were at the Village of Ap Bac Chan , approximately 20Km due south of Moc Hoa. I would like to compare notes. I have a bunch of photos. There is another MAT -62 in these pages, and it seems to me that they are a group of instructors from Di An near Ton son Nhut. I could be wrong.

      • Hi Andre,

        I was with Advisory Team 85 in Moc Hoa from early September 1967 until early April 1969. When I got there, the MACV people were integrated with the SF folks at B-41. I worked in the B-41 S2 shop as an Intel Analyst for my entire time in Moc Hoa. There were not separate CO’s or a separate chain of command for the two groups.

        I never heard of MAT Teams until I discovered this forum and the confusion surrounding MACV Team 85 or 114. I remember being on several ops between Moc Hoa and Ap Bac, specifically along the canals there.

        I question a little of your chronology because LTC Herrlein didn’t get to B41 until June 1968. The CO at B41 when I got there was LTC Stonecipher, who was followed by LTC Nagle for a brief time. LTC Herrlein was a much more personable guy than his predecessors, IMO.
        He was the only CO that I recall fondly from my time there. I was sorry to learn that he was seriously wounded shortly after I left.

        Best regards,

        • Bruce, Thanks for replying to my postage. You are absolutely correct. I was in Bac Chan form June 68 to Nov 68. I actually arrived in Vietnam in Nov 67. I was an F.O. in II Corps before going to Di Ann then Moc Hoa. We were MAT Team 62 there and then. Two names from my team are 1lt George Morgan and a Sgt Terrell. I forgot the remainder of the team. I was also a 1LT. I have not been able to contact anybody in all these years. With MAT 62 we did sweeps between Moc Hoa and Bac Chan with other ARVN Groups and US Advisors. We even went into Cambodia several times. I have a personnel reports from (somebody) years ago and it includes some names from Team 114. I did not know that Team 114 existed. If you give me your email I will share. I would like your take on some of the names. The David L. Krzeminski rings a bell. I saw that name while reading about Team 114 posting. I can’t place him.

          • You look familiar in that photograph. Appears I remember seeing saw you in Moc Hoa visiting our combined MACV Team 85 / B-41 Special Forces Compound. My. email is

            When one traveled south from Moc Hoa to Ap Bac, (along Route 29), immediately after crossing the bridge, (across this canal), a Special Forces A Team was on the right (west) side, and the MACV Team was on the left, (east) side. Further west, traveling by boat was the village of Nhon Ninh …… no Amercans in Nhon Ninh. I spent (2)weeks there.

            There was a MACV Team 85 Commander in Moc Hoa August of 1968 when I arrived as a 2nd LT; I can picture him; however, I cannot remember his name. Not long after I was there, word came down that we were to be getting our own MACV Team 85 Compound between Cong Hoa Boulevard and the 1,000 meter long Moc Hoa airfield. This MACV Commander asked all of us to grow moustaches and not shave them off until after our new MACV Team 85 Compound was built. This Team 85 Commander left before even the preliminary plans for the new compound arrived and he was replaced by LTC Ernest Terrell. A few weeks after LTC Terrell was on board, most MACV guys shaved their moustaches. When I left in August 1969 LTC Terrell was still there. I later found him in the U.S. He died some time ago. Fifty (50) years ago is a long time.


              • For those of you who may remember Dr. Manh, our Moc Hoa Hospital CEO, (Captain in SVN Army, & graduate of University of Paris)), when I departed Moc Hoa he gave me his business card and said if the VN government failed in a few years, (which many well educated VN’s expected in 1969), he told me to look him up in Paris, France because he and his wife had acquired dual Dual-Citizenship, VN & French), because of their residing in the only French Colony in French Indo-China, (i.e., Cochin-China), which was most of IV Corps including Moc Hoa, and including parts of areas above Saigon.

                Years later, I happened to come across his card, punched his name in France on my computer and found him. My wife and I went to visit him in Paris in 2012. We still communicate with one another after 50 years. I wrote to wish him Happy Easter this past Easter, and below is his recent response which can be translated on “Google Translate”:

                Bien chers Monsieur et Madame Chauvin

                Nous sommes tres heureux d avoir vos nouvelles .Merci beaucoup .Nous vous souhaitons Joyeuses Fetes de Paques .
                Je me rejouis de votre contribution aux travaux d agrandissement de l Hopital de Prevost depuis une douzaine d annee .
                A present j ai 88 ans .Nous nous vieillissons de jour en jour mais dans l ensemble ma femme et moi nous sommes en bonne sante .Je peux encore conduire la voiture pour faire le marche .
                Nos trois enfants: 2 filles , l ainee Medecin Gyneco Obstetrique est a Whashington D.c. , la seconde Chirurgien Urologue est en California et le garcon PhD in Finances at M.I.T. est a Newyork. Ils reviennent souvent nous voir .
                Je revois avec beaucoup d emotion la photo de l Hopital de Moc hoa ( Viet Nam ) que vous m avez envoyee .
                Ca fait un demie siecle que nous nous connaissons et notre Amitie grandit avec le temps .
                Nous pensons toujours a Vous .
                Vos amis Mr et Mme CHAU a Paris

            • Henry, I was at Ap Bac with Captain Wetherell when Col. Terrell was the CO of Advisory Team 85. He was sent home on emergency leave. I believe his wife was suffering from cancer. He was adamant that officers couldn’t have moustaches and as soon as he left the XO told all of us that we should grow a moustache while he was gone. It was sort of a contest, the bushiest, the longest, the ugliest. etc. I was a 20-year old 2nd Lieuy and all I had was peach fuzz. Terrell never came back from that emergency leave and IRRC he was reassigned to the pentagon. I had supper with him and his wife on my extension home leave. When the new Colonel, Bob Springman took over he judged the moustache contest and he allowed all that wanted to keep their ‘stash’ to do so, Colonel Terrell was featured in a Newsweek (?) article. He was inside Cambodia up near Long Khot and he was exchanging hats with a Cambodian border officer and the caption was something like is the American policy regarding Cambodia changing. He had his own ‘hootch’ that was outside the MACV Compound. It was a rather nice house IRRC.

          • Hi, i’m SP5 David L Krzeminski. I was part of a 5 man team Adv Tm#85 located in Moc Hoa, Kien Toung Provience. While we went on nigh ambush missions with the local soldiers, my main job was running the Orderly Room for Tm 85 in the Special Forces camp B 41. I worked for Ist Sergent Watson then 1Sg Hughes. I also had another clerk typist SP 4 Larry Quasius that worked with us. I arrived Aug 68 and left Aug 69. I hope this info helps. My e mail is

      • A number of years ago, searching for information about Moc Hoa on the web, I ran across a book offering by Faye Hanson Public Library, 206 W. Washington Street, DeWitt, Michigan. I bought the book online immediately. It was a used library book in good condition with lot’s of photos. It was entitled Moc Hoa by Larry P. Kammholz, M.D. He was an Army medical doctor stationed with B-41. The timeframe he writes about is the summer 1966 to Mid-1967. He writes about Moc Hoa. Has anyone heard of him?

        • Hi Andre,

          I bought a copy of this book several years ago, read it, and after 1975 gave my copy to my former 1968-1969 Vietnamese counterpart, Mr. Do Dinh Phuc, (native of North Vietnam), who later changed his name to Peter Do when he came to the U. S. in 1975.

          The only few families I knew while I was in Vietnam that later escaped Vietnam in 1975 was my counter part, Mr. Peter Do with his wife Yvonne and their three sons; our Moc Hoa Hospital doctor, Dr. Manh and his wife who are currently in Paris; Mr. Long, head male nurse at the Moc Hoa hospital and his daughter Co Bau who was secretary for Moc Hoa USAID’s Mr. Richard White. Mr. Long, native of North Vietnam, we were told was the boxing champion of North Vietnam when he was young. After Mr. long escaped to the U.S. he wrote a few letters to me in French. Mr. Long passed away several years ago.

          South Vietnam had quite a few Vietnamese Catholics who escaped Communist North Vietnam in the mid 1950’s. When I was in grammar school I remember our Irish Catholic nuns told us about North Vietnamese Catholics beheading Catholic Priest and Catholic Nuns and hanging their heads on fence posts. Catholics flew the Vatican Flag on their boats when approaching Tom Dooley’s Catholic rescue ship.

          Things were getting far worse with attacks in Moc Hoa in later 1969. In about July 1969, the VC began shooting 122 mm Russian made rockets that were about 10 times more destructive than their usual communist 80 mm mortars. I have a picture of a 122mm dud. VC 80 mm mortars blew a hole in a masonry building roof ….. the 122 mm rocket could hit the front masonry wall, exit the masonry rear wall and demolish the entire masonry building.


        • Thank you all for info about your time at Moc Hoa. My dad was LTC Wes Herrlein. I’m trying to put together all of his missions in Vietnam.
          Feel free to reach out to me – Kay Herrlein Mamo.
          Thank you all. I honor your service and sacrifice

          • Hi Kay,

            I was a 2nd Lt when I first met your Dad in August of 1968. I had already finished (6) years of college as a graduate architect, gone through Basic Training, Engineer AIT, Engineer OCS, and was formerly a 2nd LT Basic Training Officer with two, (2), (220) men companies Basic Training companies, (440) soldiers with (22) Drill Sergeants under me for a year at Ft. Polk, LA.

            It did not take long for me to realize that LTC Herrlein was a very compassionate individual who felt responsible for the well being and lives of all American soldiers in our Kien Tuong Province, and all Vietnamese soldiers, all Cambodian soldiers, and all American and local civilians.

            I’m sure soldiers in many provinces in our IV Corps Delta Region had B-Team Commanders, but I often wondered how many were as compassionate as your Dad. Even though all of our lives were in danger every day with various required and risky military missions, he had profound respect for all of us.

            I later stayed (29) years in the Army and retired as an LTC, and often thought back to 1968 & 1969 as to what your Dad endured in Vietnam while feeling responsible for all of us.

            He always confided in me, treated me like a gentleman, and was very deeply respected by many of us.

            As far as listing all of his missions, it would require tons of writing paper to explain all of the intricate details.


        • Oct 22, 2021

          Hi Al,

          Yes I have heard of Larry P. Kammholz, M.D.. In fact, I know him. He was US Army doctor and is a retired pediatrician living in Wisconsin. I have visited him there several times. I met him in Vietnam 1967 when he was commander of a MILPHAP USAID medical team. I was a counterintelligence special agent with the Central Registry Detachment (525th MI GP/135th MI). I was assigned as an advisor to the Vietnamese MSS colonel located in Moc Hoa. I lived with the Special Forces at B-41. I wore civilian clothes and had a civilian identity (GS-9 ID). I was provided a Vespa Motor Scooter for local transportation. I frequently visited the A camp at the end of the Air Field to drink and shoot the…

          Someone identified me in a post many years ago, but had my name wrong. I know it was me because he described me as a guy riding a motor scooter around the airfield and that I was always smiling which is a trait of mine. Most people tell me that they like my smile which I am not aware of. To my knowledge I was the only American in Moc Hoa with a motor scooter–nothing but the best for the troops.

          I also worked with the CIA operatives located in Moc Hoa and the USAID Police advisor Al Knacke (an Indiana State Trooper) who died about twenty years ago–a great guy. I see from another post that the B-41 compound was named in commemoration of CAPT GEORGE PATRICK O’TOOLE JR DET A-411 MANKATO MN KILLED DEC 12 1967. O’Toole was an Irishman and his presence was unmistakable. I enjoyed his Irish tales, limericks and songs as we drank at the B-41 bar–a nightly ritual. He was a graduate of West Point. I had left B-41 a few days before his death as I was at the end of my tour. Somehow before I left Vietnam, I learned that he had been killed in an operation a few days after I left. I was shocked by the news. It was Christmas and I was going home and he was too in a body bag to his parents. It made my journey home very unpleasant and sad.

          I did some research on him and found out that he was from Mankato Minn which shocked me as well. I was born in Minnesota and had cousins that lived in Mankato so this was another connection I had with him that I was unaware of.

          Anyway that is a brief account of my time in Moc Hoa. Lots of tales and experiences. By the way I was not attached to the 5th Special Forces. I was completely independent and on my own although I did volunteer to pull duty when asked to do so which occurred on several occasions. This included the night I volunteered to spend at the Vietnamese Army compound down the street when the VC decided to mortar the town at the usual time of 2am. By the way, I was never issued a weapon and traveled without any weapons.

          Hope everyone is doing well. I enjoy reading stories about those who served. If anyone knows about the US Army pilot who flew a single engine Cessna armed with a machine gun on one wing and a rocket pod on the other I would be interested in the info. I flew with him on a combat mission which was quite exciting as he fired his rockets and machine gun as he dove straight at the target. I also flew with the two Air Force FAC pilots who were not quite as exciting–at least when I was with them. One, I believe, was Lt Stoddard US Air Force.

          Best Regards to everyone and hang in there.

          Bob Mallalieu Central Registry Detachment IV Corps headquarters, Can Tho Vietnam.

      • Andre, I was at Ap Bac from September ’69 to July ’70. I was a part of John Paul Vann’s experimental 2-man district advisory team. Initially I was assigned as the Phoenix Coordinator. We lived in the old French “Counting House”, probably a rice grain office building. The building was located near the junction of the two major canals and the bridge over them. The ARVN Artillery base was in our “back yard”. I was a 2LT and the team chief was an old Moc Hoa hand, Captain Pete Weatherall. Pete left on what ended up being about a one month R&R and Colonel Terrell sent SFC Fred Hartwig down to make sure I didn’t get myself killed! The joke in the Province was “hey, Sarge, what’s it like to have your own second lieutenant?” I graduated from OCS in late May and was in country in September – the joke was that I didn’t even have any scratches in my gold bars! If I became a good officer it was because of the likes of Sergeant Hartwig! Off and On I served as the District Senior Advisor while I was there. We lived with our counterparts in their house and they took care of most of the house-keeping chores, We hired a maid to help out and hired a “man Friday” as well. He was a “Hoi Chan” and was very loyal to us. It cost us about 4,000 piasters a month for our food and our two hires and the government paid the freight. I also covered the DIOCC over in the next district in Toun (s.p.?) Nhon District as their Phuong Hoang Advisor.

        I had four MAT teams in my District.

        Pete “Hardcharger” Taylor
        LTC, Retired

        • Pete, Very interesting. I was in Moa Hoa from May 1968 to November 1968. I had a 5 men MAT Team. We lived in the school house by day and by night we had a hut in the RF compound. I remember the building across the bridge. Did not spend much time there. I have many questions. I think we were the first MAT Team there. Were they still calling it MAT 62 when you were there? Please send me your email.

        • Pete,
          Did you know Jose Llamas (Capt) KIA 19 Aug 69 MAT 62 or John Orlemann (2LT) KIA 19 Aug 69 MAT 62?

          What was going on with with MAT 62 in the days. I never had anyone killed while I was there?

          I also have questions about things we did with MAT 62 and what is now called Phoenix.

          I got a spreadsheet and it list a bunch of names. I am sure you may find it interesting!

          Andre LeCault

          • Andre, I tried your e-mail and it bounced. Mine is I was the “Phoenix” Advisor for Kien Binh and Kien Thoung Districts September 69-April 70 before moving to Moc Hoa. I don’t remember those two names but I do recall an incident at a MAT team where two officers were killed when a propane tank exploded at their team house. By the way Ap Bac was the “home of the Hardcharger’s”, and the Ap Bac Boat Club. LOL! I still use that nickname (Hardcharger) as my trail name on the Appalachian Trail!

    • Something I leaned this weekend. The old Province name of “Kien Tuong” was changed by the Communist to “Long An” and the Capital is “Tan An”. The geographical boundaries of the province has also changed. There is a city called “Kien Tuong” and also a city called “Moa Hoa”. I think this was done sometimes after the Vietnam war. I am trying to find the date of the change? Kien Tuong will alway be the Province where many of us pull our duty.

      • Thanks for the info on the name change. Interesting. Maybe those city names mean something in their language that wasn’t quite communist enough.

        David L. Krzeminski Tm 85

          • I was in Moc Hoa from Aug 10th 1968 to Aug 20th 1969. I worked primarily in the Tm 85 orderly room with Sp4 Larry Quasius and 1SGT Watson and then 1SGT Hughes. Major Driscoll was our CO. I also decoded intel messages foe Tm 85 and the Special Forces people in B-41. I also flew to Can Tho on Air America porters to pick up our mail often. Other people that you might remember are Sp4 Pappas and SP4 DeLuna. We all resided in the B 41 compound

            • Your name sounds familiar for some reason. At first I thought maybe you were a medic. We had a few come and visit us in Ap Bar Chan. I also thought that perhaps it was on one of the Search and Cordon patrols that B-41 had coordinated to have my RF participate. Or perhaps we just picked up our mail at B41 once in a while? Thanks for replying. Best wishes. I don’t recognize the other names you provided. I was with MAT 62 in Ap Bac Chan from June 68 to Nov 68.

      • Andre, I was just browsing through a map of Vietnam provinces during the war. If you picture Kien Tuong Province as a recliner, with the head on the upper left and the foot on the lower right, Long An Province was to the immediate east, where the foot would be. It seems the Communists merged the two provinces together and kept the name as Long An. Tan An, the capital, was almost on the Kien Tuong border in those days.

        I also did a little browsing on Google Earth and looked at our old town of Moc Hoa. There is a large Macadamia nut processing plant located there now. From MACV to MacNut…who would have guessed?

        I hope you’re doing well, my friend.


    • Haven’t seen or heard any postings in a great while. Hope everyone is alright! Hardcharger 1969-1971 (Ap Bac and Moc Hoa Team 85)

      • Hi Pete,

        I.m still kicking pretty well, though not as high as I used to. I check in periodically just to see if there’s anything new, but it’s been a little quiet around here for a while. I hope you’re doing well, and maybe your post will stir up a little activity around here again.


  17. Many thanks to the organizers of the MACV Teams site. I’ve been able to recall many forgotten memories by virtue of reading and conversing with others who were there. I salute you for your hard work.

      • Many soldiers left Vietnam and never looked back; however, appears for those of us who witnessed something like the 27 mortar rounds coming into our small B-41 compound in one night, plus other Cambodian Border Military Events, Vietnam never left us ….. and may never leave us.

        FWIW: Two nights before this 27 round hit in Moc Hoa, the VC mortar rounds came in a planned straight line, north to south, adjacent to our Cong Hoa Boulevard. Next, one night before, the VC mortar rounds were planned to come in a straight line, west to east, and perpendicular to Cong Hoa Boulevard.

        The morning before this 27 mortar round attack, my counterpart, Vietnamese Kien Tuong Province Engineer Chief, explained and warned that someone in town will later walk along these two straight lines and count his steps as he walks. With these former planned mortar hits, this same person will be able to later report to the VC the coordinates of our B-41 compound.

        Local Vietnamese soldiers he said were on the look-out, but quite a few Vietnamese men & women were walking around every day to where it was impossible to detect who was counting steps and making this report.

        Not one of the 27 that night were outside the B-41 compound.

      • MACV Team Site. Years ago I tried to get you to create a Team site for MAT IV-62. We were in AP Bach Chan (Kien Tuong Province). I was there from June 67 to November 68. The MAT Team 62 (Tan Son Nhut) shown (I don’t know who they are but it seem like they had a teaching role). From what I can tell, the MAT number was preceeded by what Corps you were in (ex. MAT IV-62 Ap Bac Chan.) you can check with MAT 114 (Henry Chauvin) as we were located in the same Province. I also have a Letter from the SF CO (LtCol Herrlein calling out MAT Team 62.
        In Moc Hoa there was also Advisory Team 85 and actually a few other MAT Teams.

        • Hi Andre,

          I’m glad you mentioned in your email your entering Cambodia from Kien Tuong Province. We had SF soldiers in Kien Tuong Province who had crossed the border several times while I was there, even though we were not supposed to do this. We heard there was a large North Vietnamese camp right across the border from Moc Hoa. Several Vietnamese citizens in Moc Hoa reported seeing this large military site when visiting relatives in Cambodia. A few wounded and captured North Vietnamese soldiers told of this camp while being treated in the Moc Hoa hospital.

          Also, on this site I mentioned that not long after returning to the U.S. in 1969 I remember seeing LTC Ernest Terrell on TV traveling in a boat along the border “inside” Cambodia and was told this was not possible because Americans did not cross over until much later. ??????

          Also the Chinese soldiers you mentioned in your email were in Moc Hoa in a separate compound further south from our B-41 Compound on Cong Hoa Boulevard housed with State Department civilians. Dr. John Goudelock and I used to visit these two civilians in their separate compound.

          In 1969 LTC Herrlein told me we had a Top Secret pick up point south of Moc Hoa where all Americans were supposed to rally in case we had a massive invasion from the North Vietnamese soldiers located across the Cambodian border. Only he and a few SF officers knew of this pick up location.

          • Henry, I was not aware at the time of the large North Vietnamese camp across in Cambodia. I was also not aware of the pickup point south of Moc Hoa. Over a beer somewhere in the future, we can talk about this subject.

            • I met LTC Herlein one day at the Mod Hoa airport to give him a ride in my jeep to B-41. Soldiers were building a counter at the Moc Hoa airfield shed where one would wait for flights. He asked me what was this new construction about. I told him they are preparing a beer and soft drink stand for when the U.S. Engineer B Company arrives to work on the Moc Hoa airfield. He could not believe it. He said he had just come back from the most Top Secret meeting ever held in Saigon discussing Top Secret planning for U. S. engineer troops coming by boat to Moc Hoa.

              The waterway movement plan involved South Vietnamese Infantry Soldiers providing protection along the waterway for when the U.S. earth moving equipment was being transported by boat. A 155 Howitzer was already placed on a school ground in Moc Hoa. Mortar support and artillery support was to be provided by South Vietnamese.

              The South Vietnamese civilians and soldiers “always” knew exactly what was going on in Vietnam. I worked every day among the South Vietnamese Engineers and Public Works workers. It was called Travaux Publiques in French, and Ty Cong Chanh in Vietnamese.

              They had workers repairing roads and bridges throughout Kien Tuong Province. These civilian workers met VC soldiers often while working in rural areas. The VC would not harm these poor Vietnamese civilians. B-41 had a 5:00 p.m. meeting for officers every afternoon where I was always invited to every meeting because lots of times I would give information to our U.S. S-2 that he never heard about. These road workers knew where and when the mimes were set up on roads by the VC.

              All of the Vietnamese I worked with in 1969 also knew that the Paris Peace talks were a joke to wear out the American public …… they joked about the group spending weeks in Paris deciding whether to sit at a round table, a square table, rectangular table or whatever.

              In addition to the large North Vietnamese Force in Cambodia across from Moc Hoa, we also heard it was a large North Vietnamese and a VC R&R center for relaxation.

              In 1969, our Moc Hoa’s Ice Plant owner had a brother who lived in the Phnom Penh, (capitol of Cambodia), who met him at the Cambodian border every week to pick up Vietnamese cash money he received in Moc Hoa for ice sales. His brother went back to Phnom Penh every week to deposit this cash in the bank of France because the Moc Hoa Ice man thought this was wise in case the South Vietnamese Government failed. I had calculated the blocks of ice sold per month. LTC Herrlein and his staff could not believe our Moc Hoa ice was making over $100,000.00 per year and made more money than the President of the United states. This ice man was really a great very refined and educated Vietnamese gentleman.

          • Just a quick note, that was a CIA compound and they were not Chinese soldiers–they were Vietnamese/Laos Hmong counterterror troops organized and trained by the CIA. They wore a skull and crossbones scarf to identify their signature skill. They were part of the Phoenix Program.

            There also was a USAID compound nearby across the street.

            Bob Mallalieu

            • Hi Bob,
              I find your vignettes quite interesting. From May 68 to Nov 68 led the MAT Team 62 (sometimes we were referred to as Mat 85) out of Ap Bac Chan. I was with the Regional Force Unit located out of that Village. With them, we often we did some excursions to the Cambodian border as well as inside Cambodia. If I recall correctly (It had been 50+ years), the RF were not all that comfortable going in Cambodia, I think they were under direction from the Province Chief not do so but stick to their village. I have a photo of me with an RF at the border. If you give me your email I would be glad to send. I don’t know how to attach it to this test.

      • Thanks, Kevin. So have you! I wish I had a clearer memory but our paths had to cross, since I was in Moc Hoa from Sept 67 until April 69.

  18. I was a young Second Lieutenant assigned as the Phoenix Advisor to the Ap Bac Team in September 1969 with CPT Pete Weatherall and SFC Fred Hartwig. In July 1970 I moved to Moc Hoa as the S-2.

  19. I would like more information on AT-85. I was there from June 68 to August 69. I was with the 736th medical detachment in Moc Hoa with the SF. Team

    • Just checking to see if anyone is still out there checking the Moc Hoa MACV site. It is interesting to reread all the messages every couple of years! Too bad we can’t post old pictures…hope all had a good Memorial Day….brought back a lot of memories of Ken Hamrick and Mike Burns.

      Jim Doyle
      aka Bomber 32
      USAF ALO/FAC 7/69-4-70

      • My name is SP5 David L. Krzeminski and was one of the orginal menbers of MACV Advisory Team #85. There was myself SFC Knutson, SSG Smith, SSG Trawick SP4 Justice. We arrived in Moc Hoa in August of 1968 and had built a small compound for ourselves in the ARVAN Forces compound 1 klick from Special Forces B41 Compound. I moved into the B-41 compound in November of 68 to work in the orderly room as a clerk typist and worked for 1st SGT Watson, then 1st Hughes. The rest of the orginal Tm 85 menbers stayed in their original barracks in the ARVAn compound. I rotated back to the US August 21 1969. I knew MAJ Hamrick and went on a FAC mission with him in early 1969. I heard that he was killed shortly after I rotated back to the States. I now live in Clawson, Michigan and have for the last 40 years.

        • Hi David:
          Rusty Hobbs here. Responding to your 8/03/2015 posting re: TM#114 and TM#85 confusion. I was assigned to MACV Advisory Team 85 from March through December of 1971. We were indeed located in Moc Hoa, Kien Tuong Province, RVN. LTC Springman was our Province Senior Advisor, (PSA) and Mr. Brady, a Civilian Contractor with CORDS, was the DPSA during my tour. I worked in the TOC and Admin.

          The confusion with the team numbers is that there were Mobile Advisory Teams, (MATs) also assigned to Moc Hoa. I can confirm MATs 114 and 112 were both assigned to Moc Hoa while i was there. I believe there were a couple more but i cannot recall their numbers.

          I hope this helps eliminate some of the confusion for everyone. I was wondering the same thing when I saw Kien Tuong listed as Team 81.
          You may contact me directly via email if you wish. I’ll do my best to recall more detail, but alas, that was a long time ago!

          • Thanks for the clarification on the Mobil Advisory Teams. That’s the part I didn’t understand. When I arrived in 68 we were the only advisory team located I SF camp B-41. There were on Mobil teams back then. And the only time we moved was when we went on night ambush missions. But I guess things changed after I left. Thanks again for the clarification.

            David L Krzeminski

          • “Rusty” what was your position at Moc Hosa in Team 85? I served with COL Springman, and I recently posted that he passed away a few years ago. I was the Province Senior Intelligence Advisor at the same time you were there. I was initially assigned to Ap Bac as the Phoenix Advisor, I was the ‘kid’ Second Lieutenant that everyone used to kid SFC Hartwig about as having his own second lieutenant. I extended in August 1970 and moved to Moc Hoa as the PSIA. I met COL Springman at Fort Leavenworth KS he was the Garrison Commander, and I was doing a six-month tour at the Federal Correctional Facility there as one of the “Wing-commanders”. COL Springman was a grat guy and he and his wife and I had a great time reminiscing about our days in Moc Hoa.

        • David, my name is Lacy Herrin. I arrived in Moc Hoa 10 NOV 70 and DEROSED a year later. SFC Knutson was still there – a nice guy as I recall. The PSA was LTC Strongman and his deputy was Chuck Brady, a civilian. I made some good friends there.

          • Hi Lacy, thanks for the reply. I’m surprised the SFC Knutson was still there when you arrived , he must of re-up’ed. The Province Chief LTC Strongman and his deputy do not sound familiar to me. I really don’t know what happen to the other members of ADV TM 85. But there was another SP4 Larry Quasius that worked in the orderly room S1. I wonder if you remember him? Thanks for the update. It was a long time ago, but there are still things that you will never forget.
            David L. Krzeminski

          • Hi Lacy: I’m surprised that SFC Knutson was still there when you arrived. He must of re-up’ed. Don’t know what happened to the other members of ADC TM 85. Do you remember a SP4 Larry Quasius he worked in S1 the orderly room?. Been a ;long time ago, but there are some things that you remember forever. Thanks for replying. If in the future you can remember more please feel free to contact me on this wedsite. Thanks again.

            David L. Krzeminski

          • Hey Lacy! Chuck Rogers here. We were 2 bad dudes going up to Saigon to replenish your AIK fund. I think about that, often. I hoe that you are well. I see and hear from Al Yetter occasionally.

            • Suprised to here SFC Knutson was there in 1970. When I got there 8 Aug 68 we were the first members of MACV Advisory Team# 85. He must of extended. Thanks for the info.

              Sent from my iPhone


              • Knutson went back for a stateside assignment and then returned for a second tour with Team 85. He worked for me and gave me fits at times.

        • Hi David. My name is Russell Horton. My uncle was a member of MACV team 85. He arrived in Vietnam in Oct.1968. His name was Staff Sargent Kyle Waldrop and he was killed Mar.12, 1969 in the Kein Tuong province. I was wondering if you might have known him or heard of him.

      • Jim, do you remember CPT “Army” Adams? he was a Bird Dog pilot assigned to TM-85. I used to fly a lot of early morning and late night VR missions with him when I was the team S-2 from August 70 – April 71. Pete “Hardcharger” Taylor

        • Pete,
          I just came across this, at the age of 74, I remember Moc Hoa like it was yesterday I was assigned to the 199th Avn Co, HQ Vihn Long

          Stay healthy brother,
          CPT Army Adams

          • “Army”, I was just stumbling through the TM-85 site and found your post from back in December 2020. Hope you are doing well. I remember you well from my days at Moc Hoa and some of the crazy things that went on on some of those VRs with you. Most of them were as boring as sin, but then….I just turned 73 and still trying to go as strong as ever. Survived Covid-1-2-3-4 and looking forward to a nice long life. Hardcharger

  20. Dear Kay,

    Your dad, Wes, and my mother were cousins. Wes’s mother, Bertha (née Dugan) Herrlein was my grandmother’s (Clara) youngest sister. The sisters in between them were Alice and Grace. If I remember correctly, Bertha named Wes’s sisters Alice and Grace too. One of them told me that Wes received his green beret personally from John Kennedy because he was among the first 32 SF soldiers deployed to Vietnam. I think he started three tours there, but never completed one, being wounded each time. The first time I ever heard of a punji stick was after he got one through a foot when he still was a captain.

    The way I heard the story of how he lost his lower left leg was that he saw the lieutenant (mentioned in a comment above) reaching for a ChiCom weapon and shouted for him not to touch it. The lieutenant did nevertheless. It had been booby trapped. Wes survived the blast because his RTO was between him and the lieutenant. The RTO took most of the shrapnel. Though heavily wounded himself, Wes carried his RTO to the helicopter and loaded him onboard. You may know that Moc Hoa was overrun shortly after Wes was evacuated and that his replacement was KIA. Later the base was rebuilt.

    During the rest of his life, Wes had repeated surgeries to remove more of his leg because the circulation in it never was right after the initial amputation. I spent eight years as an IMA in the First Special Warfare Battalion at Ft. Bragg, and so over time came to know, among others, Floyd Thompson, Arthur Simons, Charles Beckwith, and Robert Howard. Like Wes, they all died too young (although Howard did live to age 70, from my perspective that still is rather young). They all were some of the “best men God ever put into boots,” who spent so much of their lives overseas fighting for the US, they had little time in their short lives with their families.

    As a final proof that this message is not from some crank, you had surgery on an eyelid when you were about four years old didn’t you? You and I must be second cousins. I live in Germany (there is a street in Wiesbaden named for Colonel Herrlein, Wes’s dad and your grandad, who ran an Army hospital there after WWII). You can reach me at this email address:

    Best regards,


  21. Hi Kay,

    Please thank you son for serving. The current military is doing a great job.

    When I came to Moc Hoa August, 1968, I served in MACV and we reported to LTC. Herlein. He also commanded the Special Forces B-41 unit. Your father was a great officer and an excellent leader. He had the respect and admiration of both units. He was a person who led from the front.

    I am hazy on when how he had been wounded. He was visiting one of the A teams and, if I can remember correctly, stepped on an IED when he exited his chopper. The local US doctors did a great job by saving him before he was medevacked to a military hospital. I do remember that his prognosis was not good.

    I hope that the rest of his life was fruitful. He was an impressive man.

    You may want to check the Special Forces sites to find out more information about your Dad.

    I hope this helps.


    • Thank you so much!!! I do intend to phone, but these days have been busy packing all of our son’s things. What a job.
      I was going through some files of my dad’s that my mother left after she passed. It’s all of dad’s citations and only yesterday did I read the Bronze Star details. I’ve looked at the photos and awards plenty of times before. These are the details I found!

      “For heroism in connection with ground operations against a hostile force in the Republic of Vietnam:
      LTC Herrlein distinguished himself by heroism on 18 April 1969 while serving as a mission commander on a combat operation. LTC Herrlein was flying in the command and control aircraft when he was advised that a rifle platoon had come under enemy fire and several American personnel had been injured by mines. He instructed the pilots of the command and control aircraft to go into the minefield for medieval of the wounded. As the aircraft approached, the ground elements indicated a small landing zone in which the aircraft landed. With complete disregard for his own personal safety, he departed the aircraft and entered the midfield. After successfully recovering two seriously injured men, he again entered the minefield, carefully working his way towards a casualty. The rifle platoon leader who was also trying to recover an injured man, actuated a mine. The blast killed him instantly and seriously wounded Colonel Herein. Weakened from his injuries, LTC Herrlein painfully returned to the aircraft. His actions resulted in the recovery of seriously wounded soldiers from an enemy minefield, deeply inspiring every soldier on the operation. LTC Herrlein’s heroism was in keeping with the highest traditions of the military service and reflects great credit upon himself, Special Forces the United States Army.”

      My dad was a hero!

      Growing up, I knew that he had been badly wounded and not expected to survive his wounds.
      I always thought a landmine has been actuated and the blast reached his helicopter. Another soldier told me he thought that the helicopter set off the mine when it landed.

      Dad was full of shrapnel that continued to surface throughout his life. I don’t know how it got back to the helicopter. All of his internal organs had to be wired back in place.

      Dad never talked about it – at least not around me – I was only 12 at the time. Later in life I was focused on friends, school, college, then marriage and a son…I never asked.

      After he retired, which he did not want to do, he went to work for the Department of Justice.
      At 47 he had a massive heart attack and quadruple bypass surgery. Too many blood clots resulted in his losing his left leg. The heart attack and clots were found to be a byproduct of his wounds in Vietnam. He passed away at 58, in 1989.

      He and my mom lived a very blessed life. I am blessed with so many wonderful memories.

      Thank you again for reaching out and I will call you just to chat.

  22. I am sorry I fond remember him. I worked with both Dr. Plus Dr. Sholonski. I was there from June 68 till August 69. I worked in the OR at the hospital in Moc Hoa. I would like to talk to you over the phone. I can call you or you can call me. My # is 608-235-4422. If you want me to call you then please let me now

  23. In leave my note on Gerry McDonald. I mistakenly wrote he passed away on April 6. He passed away April 5, 2016. My mistake.

  24. It is my understanding that my brother, Lt. Gerald F. McDonald, served an advisor with the Mobile Advisory Team IV-114, Kien Tuong Province beginning in March 1971 until sometime later that year when he was assigned to work with USAID. Gerry, who was from New York when entering the US Army and recently lived in Richmond, Va, passed away on April 6, 2016. He did not talk much about Vietnam very often. In helping my family help organize his things, we found a document which referred to his assignment to MAT IV-114 Kien Tuong Province. I am passing this information on to those who may have known him during his time in Vietnam. To all of you who served, thank you for your service.

    • Your brother must have arrived to MAT114 shortly after I rotated back stateside. I was replaced as team leader by a captain. The team should have had an assistant team leader, but I never did. Maybe your brother became the new assistant team leader. I don’t remember the captain’s name now. Mat114 was a good team made up of great professional NCO’s. I wish I could have stayed with them longer

      Sorry for your loss. Maybe one of the other team members will provide you with information regarding your brother’s VN tour. Memories of those days are getting foggy for many of us. Good luck .

      Scott Bogert

      • Scott. Thank you for replying and your condolences. If I find any information related to my brother’s time in Vietnam with MAT-114, I will post.

  25. Hi Scott,
    Do you remember MSGT Robert M Liddell KIA on May 1, 1970 during mortar attack on Dong Tam Base Camp, he served
    with the 114 472 Sig Battalion. I have a photo of him, would you be able to recognize him? Members of his family are
    hoping to locate anyone who may have served with Robert.
    Bob Harik

    • Bob

      I don’t remember MSGT Liddell at all. Sorry, but I can’t even remember the names of everyone on my team. I remember just a couple and the other names escape me now, but not their faces. I truly wish that I could help you.
      MAT 114 was in the field a lot of the time but we had a team house located in Moc Hoa. We were part of MACV Team 85, but we were mobile and seldom went to the Team 85 compound. It torments me not knowing what happened to the team after the swing ship picked me up in the field for stateside rotation.
      I met a lot of good people that I enjoyed knowing. Maybe someday it will all come back to me.
      Good luck with your search.


  26. November 6 2015
    MSG 8 Robert M Liddell ADV Team 114 HQ 1970, looking for photo of
    Robert, can anyone help me out.
    Bob Harik, Yuba City, California

  27. I wonder why the MACV team located in Moc Hoa is constantly referred to TM#114. I was stationed there from Aug 4 1968 to Aug 21 1969 and the team that I belonged to was MACV Team # 85. Can someone please explain this to me.

      • Hi Bruce, My name is Eddie Horton. My uncle was at MACV Team from Oct 1968 and was killed during a mortar attack on Mar.12 1969 in Kien Tuong province. His name was Sgt. Kyle Waldrop and was a medic. I was just wondering if you new of him.

        • Hi Eddie, your uncle’s name is very familiar to me but I can’t recall him or the attack in which he was killed. If you scroll down to David Krzeminski’s message of 9/14/2018, he mentions a Special Forces Staff Sergeant who was killed by a faulty mortar round near that time period, and I’m wondering if that may have been your Uncle Kyle. I wish I could be more help but those memories of 50 years ago are fading fast.

          At any rate, I am sorry for your loss and would like for you and your family to know that his was a noble sacrifice for his nation. I offer a solemn salute for his honorable service.

          • B-41 1969 Mortar Pit Accident: In addition to what David Kremenski commented on below, I find it difficult to remember the so many soldiers names we encountered while in the Army from 50 years ago, so I really do not remember the name of the sergeant who was killed in the B-41 mortar pit that night but I do remember this incident. The B-41 mortar pit was always manned by B-41 Special Forces sergeants as opposed to MACV soldiers. This mortar pit accident happened around midnight, not too long after the B-41 Club was closed.

            As usual, the outgoing mortar rounds leaving the B-41 mortar pit that night did not sound too loud partly because there was about a 48″ tall circular wall surrounding said pit which was located on the Cong Hoa Boulevard, (west) side perimeter of the B-41 compound. After hearing this sergeant firing several outgoing rounds, those of us who were still awake heard one very loud round that sounded exactly like an incoming round that we thought most likely had landed “inside” our compound.

            Normally, when any first incoming round was heard, inside or outside of our compound, it was SOP for the CQ to hit the siren switch in the centrally located B-41 Orderly Room. Immediately after the siren blasted, some soldiers dove under their bunks to wait for the incoming rounds to cease, because we were told that there were bags of rice hulls under our fiber cement roofs resting on wood poles where these bagged rice hulls in attics offered some shrapnel protection and were also used in Moc Hoa by Vietnamese families to try to help keep the mortar shrapnel from entering their living quarters below.

            Other soldiers in our compound did not trust the bags of rice hulls, did not wait a few minutes for the incoming rounds to stop, and ran straight to our individually assigned perimeter bunkers. In any case, after incoming mortar rounds ceased, everyone grabbed their flak jackets, rifle and ammo, and finally rushed to their formerly assigned bunkers.

            I remember all of us crammed in this bunker that night, waiting for someone to come to report an “All Clear” announcement; however, after a very long wait, no “All Clear” report. Next, finally quite some time later, a soldier came to tell us that the round we heard had gone off in our mortar pit and after looking around and trying to find out what happened, sergeant ???? was later found dead. After the Ammo Storage Building fire was extinguished, many of us from a distance went to look at this mortar pit accident scene. I vividly remember all of us were told by several compassionate Special Forces sergeants to please not try to look inside this mortar pit.

            The following morning, I took a black and white photo of the Vietnamese removing the damaged corrugated roof off of the Ammo Storage Building. Some explosives went off and lifted part of this roof.

            It was always sad for all of us to see and/or hear of our U.S. soldier’s lives lost …… looking back, our U.S. soldiers never did lose that Vietnam Conflict.

            In my humble opinion, and in the opinion of many mature Vietnamese that I served with back then in IV Corps thought it was a very carefully planned Congressional non-ending money grab by a U.S. Congress who wanted to obtain kick back political contributions from those corporate executives who sold military uniforms, gun powder, weapons, uniforms, petroleum products, tactical vehicles, air craft, naval vessels, etc., etc.

            I remember President Kennedy wanted to only send U. S. Advisors to allow these very intelligent Vietnamese to rise and form a military force of their own …… but that was totally unacceptable at that time. President Diem was first assassinated, the following week our President Kennedy was assassinated, and then it all began among the greedy as carefully planned with really no end in sight. It all could have been handled much differently …. I very well remember that even John Paul Van told us that there was no end in sight when he visited us in our Moc Hoa Mess Hall.

  28. Thanks Doug,

    In reply your comment on the AHC helicopter downed on 1 September 1969, (after I left Vietnam), it is always sad to hear of loss of American life and/or Vietnamese life in Vietnam. As advisors, some of us found many good VN friends.

    Most of us knew former soldiers inscribed today on that most sad VN Wall.

    There was an earlier border incident that happened during the day in 1969 when a U.S. helicopter was shot down with a mortar round over Cambodia slightly north of Moc Hoa..

    As an advisor, I heard the details from my Vietnamese counterpart who heard the details from a Vietnamese civilian who crossed the Vietnamese/Cambodian border often. This civilian actually saw this downed helicopter.

    About six (6) days later, a description of the downing of this helicopter came from home by mail, which had been printed in the New Orleans Times Picayune newspaper.

    I also remember Moc Hoa shops had expensive china that was manufactured in Communist China that was delivered across the Kien Tuong border from Cambodia. We were warned in our B-41 Compound that if we tried to bring home such items or other items found in Moc Hoa made in Communist China, they would be confiscated by Americans in a pre-customs check prior to departure to the U. S. ….. not long afterwards, Nixon made friends with China & the U. S. began trading with China.

  29. I just found this site and read some of your comments.
    I also was in Moc Hoa, B-41 compound from June 68 – Aug.69 with advisory team 85 as a medic. I new the Dr’s very well. I worked in the operating room for the duration of my tour. I would like to hear from any one who also was there.

  30. In above June 5, 2015 message, delete 1963 and substitute 1863 … some say 1862; and for historical purposes, the former separate French Colony of Cochin-China, (in Indo-China), included all of Saigon, its Capitol, and a few provinces above Saigon and all provinces South of Saigon..

  31. FWIW: After all of us who lived in B41 are all gone, someone may be looking at this site like

    Anyway, Randy Shotwell was a Captain and a most dedicated and very compassionate person who worked with Dr. John Goudelock at the Moc Hoa Hospital with Vietnamese Doctor Manh and Vietnamese male nurse Mr. Long. There were several U. S. enlisted medics who worked with them along with several Vietnamese nurses.. After each mortar attack, often at midnight or 3:00 a.m. this whole medical group would pile up in (2) jeeps and head up Cong Hoa Boulevard, (in the dark), up to the Moc Hoa Hospital to take care of casualties. Even though medics are not supposed to be armed, because the Moc Hoa Hospital had no perimeter guards, they all left the B-41 compound well armed with rifles pointing in the air. On occasion, Randy used to put on sun glasses in the B-41 club and sing a few blues. I had heard from Dr. John Goudelock in about 1980 that Randy was a medical advisor of sorts living in Virginia. Mr. Long wrote to me several times after coming to California in 1975, but later died …still have his letters written in French. A couple of years ago my wife and I went to visit Dr. Manh and his wife who currently live in Paris. Dr. Manh had recently contacted Dr. Goudelock via email. Dr. Manh was a graduate from the University of Paris.

    Kien Tuong Province was part of IV Corps, which was the former French Colony called Cochin-China since 1963, where anyone born prior to 1948 could apply for and be granted French citizenship. All of the Vietnamese who had attended school prior to 1955 or so in this former French Colony, with at least a 3rd grade education, were educated in French and I immediately found that they all spoke French fluently in addition to Vietnamese. — North Vietnam was different during colonia times and was formerly a French Protectorate, and I, II, and III Corps were formerly part of Annam, a Vietnamese Colonial Kingdom under former Vietnamese King Bao-Dai who was still living in France in the late 1960’s..

    I remember after a mortar attack Colonel Herlein held a ceremony in B-41 to award Purple Hearts to several who were injured in a mortar attack. On one particular mortar attack occasion, some were wounded when a mortar round hit near the entrance to a bunker and shrapnel circled around along the inside wall of the bunker injuring several. I stayed in the Army Reserves 26 years after leaving Moc Hoa in August of 1969 … never forget faces, but have difficulty with names after meeting so many in the Army in the remaining 26 years.

    I think if someone would look up Dr. John Goudelock, he would remember all of his assigned officers and enlisted personnel. He was originally from New Albany, Mississippi. He and I entered and left Vietnam about the same time ….. he always worked tirelessly and was a very dedicated, gifted, and talented doctor and surgeon.

    • Hi, My name is Kay Herrlein Mamo. My father was LTC Wesley Herein. He retired in 1971. He passed away in 1989. I’m trying to research his time in Vietnam. I just read your post from last year. Do you know about his being wounded on April 18, 1969?
      My son, George Wesley, is following in his footsteps and will report to Ft Benning next week.

  32. Please disregard.
    Sadly, for those of you who may have known him, Randy passed away in 2008 in Virginia Beach, Virginia.

    Someone may still be able to inform me however. It seems Randy was a Captain, and a medical officer. I’m pretty sure the fellow that helped me at the B-41 compound that day was an enlisted medic.

    Any thoughts? Sp5 Ron Petell?

  33. Can anyone let me know how to reach Randy Shotwell? He may have dressed my injury after a daylight mortar attack at the B-41 compound, around March 1969.

    Marc Ericksen, 2Lt., asst Team Leader, MAT 62, Moc Hoa.

  34. Kevin–

    Thanks for the feed back! Guess I’ll let the deceased lie in peace. No need
    pummeling his loved ones over the head with the fact he was not SF. You’re
    right about the disproportionate influence the military had on our lives. But
    I’d do it again in a heartbeat! Ha!

  35. I saw the name Durus Bailey here. I grew up with him. He came from a broken home (as we called it in the 1950s) and was prone to elaborate stories to pump up his ego. He played drums and claimed to have played Gene Krupa to a tie in a drum battle!

    I joined the Army in 1967. He was drafted around the same time. After his discharge I met him at a local store where he claimed to have been a Green Beret! His obituary (just do a search for Durus Bailey, Sr., honoring memories) makes the same claim. He was a very intense fellow and made Solider of the Month, but I find it hard to believe he was Special Forces (he was only enlisted for two years). Can anybody shed light on this for me? Thanks!

    • Hi Jon,

      I knew Durus well. He worked for me and was a SP 5 when I left country in July, 1969.

      In spite of Durus’ need to exaggerate, he was a good worker. I am not surprised that he received a “Soldier of the Month” award. If I remember correctly, I put him in for his promotion to Spc 5.

      You are right. Durus was not SF. He was part of MACV Advisory Team #85. We worked for a SF Ltc. from about June 1968 until January, 1969. The Ltc. also ran the SF Detachment, B-41, that had responsibility for the SF operations in Kien Toung Province. Special Forces was nice enough to share their compound with us. MACV finally moved into their own compound in about September, 1969 (I was back stateside by then). Although we were billeted with SF, we were separate from them and had a separate mission to support the RF/PF forces in the Province.

      Strangely enough, Durus found me 30 years after Vietnam service. He called to ask for help with a PTSD VA application that he was making. I was living in Ann Arbor, MI at the time and he was in Oklahoma. I wrote a letter for the VA that explained that the SF compound was frequently under mortar attack and the stress of being mortared could cause PTSD. In his claim for PTSD, Durus also mentioned experiences he had which rivaled John Wayne’s movie career. As you said, he was prone to exaggeration. He did get a 100%+ rating for PTSD and was quite grateful for my letter of support. He even sent Omaha Steaks as a thank you gift after he received his rating and back pay.

      Durus kept in close contact (I remember his 3 AM calls well) until close to the end of his life. I kick myself for insisting he only call before 10 PM eastern. He stopped calling a few months before he died. He said he was down to 85 lbs. near the end of his life.

      As I said above, Durus was really a hard worker and a pretty nice guy.

      I hope this answers your questions about him. If not, just shoot me another email.

      Thanks for serving. The few years that many of us have spent in service has left a disproportionate influence on our lives.


  36. Hi Trevor,

    Appears I remember this soldier with the Moc Hoa MACV Team 85 medical guys.

    I don’t have addresses or phone numbers of the following 2 former MACV Team 85 soldiers; however, if you could Google Dr. John Goudelock originally from & later working around New Albany MS, or Medical NCO Supervisor Randy Shotwell who later worked around D. C. or the East Coast, I am sure they could definitely provide details.

    These medical guys mostly worked out of the Vietnamese Moc Hoa Hospital on Cong Hoa Boulevard, (south of the B-41 Compound), associated with the Vietnamese Chief of Staff Doctor Manh, a graduate from University of Paris.

    After every Moc Hoa mortar attack, (always either around midnight or around 3:00 a.m.), almost the entire MACV medical group would head down to the Vietnamese Hospital in 2 jeeps to attend to casualties.

    I stopped to visit with Dr. Manh & his wife a couple of years ago in Paris.

    Not much, but maybe every little bit helps.

  37. Hi there I just found this website and I was wondering if you knew anything about Dallas Lamdon Padgett? He died in 1969 and i was looking to get some more info about his death and his unit as a whole.

  38. Hi Marilyn,

    I cannot disagree with your above comments.

    I was strangely ordered to go to the border by UAAID & MACV in late 1969, but I never crossed.

    Many things done never made too much sense.

    At the end of 1968 & beginning of 1969, I remember my counter part, (Do Dinh Phuc), & I discussing how Sihanouk was trying to test the waters to try to normalize relations with the U. S. for far more reasons than one. Also knew a guy in MIKE Forces from Martinique who was a former French Legionnaire who spoke of relations with Cambodia often.

    Sihanouk appointed General Lon Nol who was negotiating with the Americans prior to Sihanouk’s deposition, & prior to Sihanouk’s long vacation away from Phnom Penh..

    Just from what I heard back then, I doubt seriously if Sihanouk was aware the true nature of secrete talks between the U. S. & General Lon Nol; hence, when he began hearing of the very forceful plans for his deposition it was all too late.

    The bombing missions in Cambodia were supposed to be secrete; but ;like anything else, I remember the Vietnamese knew everything going on … all one had to do was ask.

    I never found out all of the details of LTC Terrell’s orders about Cambodia, but I thought it had to do with local Kien Tuong Vietnamese Soldiers as opposed to ARVN soldiers from elsewhere. On TV I remember seeing his interpreter riding with him in that boat in high water marsh land.

    When General Abrams came to Moc Hoa after Nixon’s Vietnamisation plans were beginning, both SF B-41 Commanders & MACV Team 85 Commanders were shocked when he left & he did not stop in at B-41 to see them ….. he went further south down Cong Hoa Boulevard to visit with the CIA civilians & State Department USAID & held a private meeting on what we were told was on Cambodian operations.

    I recognized & saw this same CIA guy a year later in New Orleans & he ran from me. I tried to catch up with him, but I later realized he did not want to be recognized.

    After becoming friends with, & reviewing the Moc Hoa’s ice man’s operation on the Vam Co Tai River adjacent to the Moc Hoa water plant, he confided in me that he was making over the equivalent of $100.00.00 in U. S. Dollars a year selling ice in Kien Tuong Province. He met his brother on the Cambodian border every week to give him money to deposit in his bank account in the Bank of France.

    I wrote to about 4- 5 Vietnamese until 1975 after I left Moc Hoa including Doctor Manh at the Moc Hoa hospital — after the Communist flag went up in April 1975 I quit writing. They all wrote in French,

    Several of the Vietnamese who made it to the boats & came here to California were getting information from Moc Hoa through the Vatican — lots of the news was so very sad.

    I spoke to LTC Terrell several years ago but his wife Aylene later told me he died.



  39. Hi Tom,

    His report which happened around late August of 1969 appears very factual for several reasons.

    I left Vietnam with MACV Dr. John Goodelock to come home maybe around August 26, 1969.

    MACV Commander LTC Terrell in August 1969 was trying to get me to stay in Moc Hoa another 6 months or a year to supervise the final construction of the new MACV compound, & also to assist with his very “new” Joint Vietnamese Infantry Mission to enter where we were never allowed to visit …………………… i.,e., Cambodia.

    Prince Sinaouk was overthrown when he visited China & U. S. friendly Cambodian General Lon Nol had just taken over Cambodia..

    Entering Cambodia was supposed to be a Top Secret joint MACV/South Vietnamese mission. The civilian USAID State Department Mr. Richard White was the big boss in Kien Tuong Province at that time who took all orders from State Department’s John Paul Van & passed them on to the Moc Hoa military SF & MACV.

    Moc Hoa was only about 5-6 miles from the unmarked Cambodian no-fly zone.

    Anyway, right after I got home, maybe August 31, 1969 I turned on the TV 6 o’clock news, & I see LTC Ernest Terrell riding in a boat, “in Cambodia”, accompanied by several South Vietnamese Infantry soldiers in boats & South Vietnamese Infantry ground troops.

    Not too long prior to this, when I was still in Moc Hoa, a U.S. work helicopter was shot down with a mortar round after flying over a Cambodian Army Base north of Moc Hoa — this made newspapers all over the U. S.

    Because the border was difficult to see from the air, the work helicopter unit requested that someone from Moc Hoa ride with the Monday, Wednesday, & Friday work helicopter pilot to point out the border.

    Naturally because I was the only Engineer Officer in the then Kien Tuong Province, & because U. S. Army Engineers are the Army cartographers who draw military maps, guess who got to ride shotgun in the chopper every Monday, Wednesday, & Friday with the pilot — I just made damn sure we did not enter Cambodia. I’ never forgot our local map coordinates beginning with X-ray-Sierra, (XS).

    Hope this helps.


    • Henry : well we all deal with the “mists of time ” ….. Sihanouk was deposed in March of 1970. ARVN/US troops crossed the border in the last days of April , first days of Ma y 1970. Prior to that occasional ad hoc border crossings occurred to recover bodies from shoot downs, typically by SF due to their camp locations or conventional infantry circumstantially nearby. Other than that nobody was in Cambodia , Laos etc other than MACV/SOG .

      Sent from my iPad


      • I was at an Intelligence Base in Honolulu then later at Trax HQ’s in Binh Hoa. One of my jobs was tracking KIA/WIA’s..there were thousands of KIA Cambonians in late 1970’s from US air strikes…many US Army troops (100’s) were transfered out of the Army to work for the CIA to demo Cambon’s bridges along the boarder. So, much changed in 1970 and 71.

    • Henry : that actually sounded a little snarky ….. That was not my intent . We were very close to the border. All the B-41 A-Camps and Moc Hoa itself were very close. Our (A-413) FOB was right on the line on the SE corner of the Crow’s Nest. Terrell may have been on the Vam Co Tay or other tributary close to the border, but I don’t believe he was in Cambodia with ARVN troops in 1969.

      Sent from my iPad


    • On 1 September 1969 a 114th AHC helicopter UH-1D 66-16849 was shotdown just inside Cambodia near Moc the night time . The Special Forces officer on board was Captain Michael Thomas Burns. He was badly wounded and died 6 September 1969.

  40. Henry : Google ” Witness to night shoot down” a blog entry from a 114th AHC Red Knight pilot that references staging out of Moc Hoa and picking up troops from my former camp BTT SF Detachment A-413 . But it doesn’t jibe with our detachment history, and he IDs the American advisor as MACV. Was the pilot confused, and does anyone recognize this engagement ? Tom

    • Tom, do you remember SFC Robert Lee Henderson? We are trying to get him honored but need a photo of him. Can you help. Maybe giv eus a lead?

      • Jim : I’m SO SORRY ! I must have missed your post . I haven’t been in this site in a long time . Just got an email today that took me back to the thread. I DEFINITELY remember Robert L. Henderson ( Hendu as we called him). He was a weapons specialist on our team A-413 BTT (Binh Thanh Thon) . I was the XO. He was mortally wounded on June 15, 1970 leading a Camp Strike Force element in Cambodia. I was back at B-41 at the time , probably scrounging supplies or picking up payroll. The S-3 hunted me down and told me of the contact and that casualties were inbound. I grabbed a jeep and headed to meet the choppers. I helped unload the wounded, and then the KIAs. Hendu and our interpreter Lat were two of them. They would have been in the command group. The senior SF medic, whose name I can’t remember, pulled me into the dispensary and said ,”We take care of our own”. He then had me help prep Hendu’s body before transfer to graves registration. If he hadn’t been one of my brothers , this would have been more than difficult for me to do, and I’ve treated seriously wounded under fire. This was different. It is forever etched in my mind. There are days on the calendar EVERY year that I pause to remember my fallen team members. On June 15th every year I look up and tell Hendu he is remembered , and I hope I have been able to live my life in a way that honors his sacrifice.i have very few photos of my time in country. Actually I had none until 3 years ago when my 94 year old father told me there was some “stuff ” of mine in the attic. It wasn’t much , but it included about a dozen photos I’d sent home and my dear departed mother had saved. Unfortunately Hendu isn’t in any of them. There is one impromptu team photo and I can pretty much narrow down the time frame. I believe Hendu would have still been there, but not all team members are in it. Probably in the field. How did you know Hendu and if there’s ANYTHING I can do to help honor him, please let me know ! I have touched his name on The Wall MANY times.

  41. Tom,

    Sincere thanks for B-41 information — I had seen this B-41 information a few years back.

    From August 1968 to August 1969 I was assigned to MACV Team 85 in Moc Hoa which was even for years prior to this & afterwards co-located in Special Forces Compound B-41 in the town of Moc Hoa,in Kien Tuong Province.

    I have no idea why MACV Team 85 is listed here on this site in conjunction with, or associated with Tieu Can-Vinh Binh ………….. or why Kien Tuong is listed with MACV Team 114 in lieu of MACV Team 85

    Few years from now we may all be forgotten.


  42. I note references to B-41. Don’t see any recent posts. If anyone is still looking , Google Special Forces books (RadixPress) B-41 and you will find a roster of SF personnel who served there. It is self reported (through the mists of time ) and so not necessarily complete or completely accurate as to dates and assignments. But Sherm has done a great job gathering all this. You can also search B-41 A-Team personnel rosters by team designation eg A–413 , A-415 etc, or camp name BTT, Tuyen Nhon etc

  43. Hi Eddie,

    If he was in the B-41 Compound located in Moc Hoa, co-located with us, i.e., also with MACV Team 85, I would probably remember him if I saw a photo; however, some Special Forces personnel were out away from Moc Hoa scattered in smaller A Teams in Kien Tuong Province & we did not see them very often.

    Also, some Special Forces soldiers were located across the Moc Hoa 1,000 meter long airfield, (a little further west), in the Special Forces MIKE Forces Compound. They were advisors to the South Vietnamese soldiers of Cambodian origin. We did not see them often either.

    Soldiers of Cambodian origin & soldiers of Vietnamese origin never got along at all, so the U. S. kept them separated in separate military compounds.

    The Vietnamese are of Chinese origin & were known years ago as Mongoloids; & the Cambodians are of East Indian origin & were known years ago as Caucasians; hence, this is why these colonies were formerly named Indochina.

    Just hope this helps.


    • Henry, the small SF camp at the Moc Hoa airfield was A-414. You’re right about the SF soldiers separating the ARVN troops from the Cambodians who made up most of the local Mobile Strike (Mike) Force unit. SFC Margarito “Chico” Fernandez was shot by ARVN troops when he attempted to break up a fight between them and the Mike Force soldiers near the airfield. Chico held on for several months but then died in March 1969, I believe. He was a great SF trooper and a good friend of mine.

      • Hi Bruce,

        SFC Fernandez was indeed a very remarkable soldier’s soldier. No doubt he impressed so many of us all. So sad to hear of his death in 1969.

        Whether he was addressing a Buck Private or a Bird Colonel, his profound respect and attention given to individuals was not altered because of one’s different rank or different branch of service.

        He appeared to feel that we were all here in Moc Hoa like one unified, very respectable American family trying to assist one another.

        • Hi Henry,

          It seems we were in Moc Hoa at the same time but my memory has faded so much over the years. When I got there (Sep 67) there were only a dozen or so non-SF troops who made up the Team 85 contingent. I was always amazed at how those elite troops treated us so well and were genuinely happy to have us around. By the time I left (Apr 69) several smaller units had been brought in to Moc Hoa, to the point where there were maybe 75 of us stationed there.

          In addition to Chico Fernandez, we lost Captain George P. O’Toole in December ’67, along with three of his troops from A411 (My Phuoc Tay). Sgt Bill Baer, an SF medic from A414, was KIA in May ’68. I was on that operation, although in a different sector. They were all heroes.

          I hope you are healthy and happy. Welcome home, Brother.

          • The B41 compound at Moc Hoa was named for Captain O’Toole after he was KIA in December 1967. I have a picture of the gate with the sign for the detachment and another sign below with Capt. O’Toole’s name on it, if anyone’s interested. I also recall Snuffy, the python that lived there. Anyone recall “Lucky,” the young Vietnamese kid who was sort of adopted by the group there? Or Loan, the young (and beautiful) seamstress who worked in the compound?

          • Hi Bruce,

            As far as SFC Fernandez, it was prior to noon, before chow, maybe 11:00 a.m., where we heard one or two live fire rifle shots from around the Moc Hoa Market (Cho) area near the Vam Co Tay River …. next the customary rapid fire from the same area by a Vietnamese soldier to alert the town …… then silence …. maybe 10 minutes later heard rifle fire coming from the Mike Forces Cambodian Compound near the airfield ….. a few hand grenades were thrown, and SFC Fernandez had already immediately rushed out in a jeep and drove out to the nearby airfield …… a Vietnamese light armored vehicle came on the scene. A few more shots came, then a cease fire. After the cease fire we were lined up at B-41 Mess Hall door which faced south. I was standing behind MACV Cpt. & Dr. Goudelock. SFC Fernandez came to the chow line where Cpt. Goudelock asked if anyone was hurt. SFC Fernandez told us a Cambodian soldier was in down town Moc Hoa where he left a Vietnamese prostitutes shack without paying. The prostitute was screaming when a few Vietnamese soldiers came to help. This Cambodian soldier ran around trying to hide near a few shacks, and finally fled downtown riding a bicycle on the airfield going south towards his Mike Force Compound. Vietnamese soldiers were firing around him to try to stop him and Cambodian solders were returning fire. SFC Fernandez said when he walked out in the center, the firing stopped. After telling us this, he next raised his fatigue shirt to show Dr. Goudelock where he thought he was hit maybe with shrapnel from maybe a grenade. It was in his kidney area right above his waist line, and not bleeding. Dr. Goudelock looked very carefully, said nothing and immediately brought SFC Fernandez to his B-41 1st aid building and called for a medivac. Later that afternoon Dr. Goudleock told me he immediately saw green in and around the wound ….. it was metal oxidation from Vietnamese bullets that probably got wet ….. he said this was serious and he did not know if SFC Fernandez would survive internal spreaded infection caused by same. We later heard he had died. So sad.


            • Thank you, Henry. I’m amazed at the level of detail you’re able to recall about a 50-year-old incident, but I appreciate your clarifying things for me. I don’t think I was aware of his injury until after he was evacuated, but I can clearly recall being devastated — not only at his loss but at how senseless the entire tragedy was.

              • Hi Bruce,

                As mentioned before, at 26 years old, I came as a MACV Engineer Lt. Advisor in August of 68 and left in August of 69. Worked every day away from B-41 sharing an office with the Kien Tuong Province Vietnamese Engineer, Lt. Do Dinh Phuc, Engineer Chief of Public Works who had a large staff of civilians running the Moc Hoa water plant, Mod Hoa Electrical generator site, and maintaining all Kien Tuong Province roads, bridges, and airfields. Lt. Phuc spoke some English, but none of his educated engineer type workers in his office spoke English ….. in his office and way out in the field with senior village chiefs, we all conversed in French 24/7. All these Vietnamese knew their South Vietamese past President Go Dinh Diem (SP?) …… Moc Hoa was his former summer resort …. he had built the small little lakes and hills on the south end of Cong Hoa Boulevard with the Catholic maintained statue of the Blessed Virgin on the top of the hill..

                But like many of us, we may remember faces from back then better than names. I can remember the faces of the MACV Team 85 Commander prior to later MACV Team 85 LTC Ernest Terrell, but not this MACV departing commander’s name ….. he had asked all MACV members to grow mustaches until our new MACV Compound was built near the airfield at the south end of Cong Hoa Boulevard; however, when he left and LTC Harrell came, we all in MACV shaved our bothersome mustaches. LOL

                I can remember the faces of SF LTC Herlein, SF SGt Evans, SF SGT Majors, MACV 1st SGTS Watson & Hughes, MACV S-1 Cpt Bud Graves and his S-1 replacement, MACV Major Driscoll, SF Cpt. Wetherall who left Moc Hoa by Medevac after his jeep hit a land mine driving down Route 29 to Ap Bac, and so many, many more American soldiers in our small group ….. and even remember the Vietnamese barber who entered our compound to give us haircuts and the Cambodian maid who cleaned our part of the officer quarter’s rooms and shinned our boots ….. I bought her a gold wrist watch when I left Moc Hoa.

                Tall slim Co Lan, Cambodian; and short plump Co Mai Vietnamese, were our main bar maids in the B-41/Tm 85 Club/Bar. SGT Roush, (who had a Vietnamese wife, and was a cook for General Westmoreland) was our B-41 mess sergeant. When General Westmoreland left Vietnam, he transferred to B-41. On his first trip to Saigon to order food, he traded an SF captured AK-47 for the new Pop-Corn machine in the bar …. Wow!

                So many of these events I never think about until I hear from guys like you and many others on this Forum …. appears like yesterday.

                Be nice to be able to post photos on this site.

                • Henry, Do you remember SF Captain Rod Savaugeau? I worked in the B41 Intel shop for him after the previous S2 left (whose name I can’t recall). He showed up at Moc Hoa toward the end of my first year and then I extended my tour for six months to get the early out they were offering at the time. Rod was a character, but something about his being a renaissance man made me enjoy working for him. He brought a woman to Moc Hoa who was a stunning half Vietnamese/French beauty. She wasn’t there for long but I don’t have a clue as to where she went or why.

                  When I got there in September 1967, LTC Stonecipher was the CO and was replaced by LTC Nagle before Wes Herrlein came along. My first SGM was Herman “Pappy” Naumann, and he was followed by SGM Henry Czerniak. Czerniak loved his poker and played every night in the club. Tony Pappas was another good poker player I remember fondly.

                  Pappas talked me into taking his expensive AE-1 camera to Australia when I went on R&R, even though I had no clue how to use it. I shot pictures all over Sydney and not a single one of them came out.

                  It’s crazy how these memories come flooding back when I start to open up the vault, but I sure wish I had kept a journal and documented my time over there.

                  I took a recent look at Moc Hoa using Google Earth and could barely figure out where things used to be, compared to what it looks like now. I did come across an article about Moc Hoa a few years ago that said there is a large Macadamia Nut processing plant there now. From MACV to MacNut…I guess there could be some logic there.

                  • Hi Bruce,

                    I just went on the new TWS Military site and saw your photo and I do vividly remember seeing you in the B-41 compound …. names are so often vague; however, I just never forget faces.

                    I used to leave B-41 every morning at about 6:30 a.m., stayed with Vietnamese engineer type civilians all day long, return for lunch at noon, and return at about 6:30 p.m. when I was in the Moc Hoa area.

                    Some times USAID Mr. Richard White and his assistant Mr. Harry Johnson sent me out to Nhon Ninh Village west of Ap Bac, and different locations with Vietnamese civilians who were repairing VC damaged bridges, road repair, new village school huts, etc.

                    With a duty roster, once a week we were sent out at night from dusk to dawn to patrol the area on the Cambodian side of the Vam Co Tay River with an FM radio and a squad of Vietnamese infantry soldiers. Some nights were sent out to stay at Vietnamese outpost sites and bridge sites. Other nights we had Tactical Operations Center (TOC) duty from dusk to dawn monitoring the (TOC) radios and keeping a written journal of whatever happened. When we returned they let us sleep from about 6:30 a.m. until noon.

                    The name SF Captain Rod Savaugeau is a real brain strain but with your short description I am beginning to mentally connect to a Captain with a unique, calm personality who just always had his act together …… I think this may have been the Captain who had accrued a few more days of military leave and rather than go to Japan, Hong Cong, Australia, etc., he left Moc Hoa and came back after visiting Germany.

                    I cannot remember the SF Sergeant who sang and played the guitar at night at the bar in the club …… he often sang “I want to go Home” and “Okie from Muskogie”, “Trailers for Sale or Rent”, etc. I played a few old time instrumental tunes for him on his guitar now and then.

                    I was coming out of the club one evening walking with a Sp-4 who had a roll of toilet paper in one hand and a box of envelopes in the other hand. He stopped to tell SF SGM Czerniak hello and after SF SGM Czerniak told him hello, he told this guy, “Hmmmmm ….looks like your are going Sh*t and write letters.” There were always humorous comments now and then.

            • Henry, I’ve heard so many theories as to how my dad (Margarito Fernandez) died so many years ago. I was born December 68 and he killed March 69. Your recollection of the details seem to align with the most common story of some sort of “friendly fire” incident. Thanks for caring enough to post your memories. It means a great deal to me.

              Art Fernandez

              • Hi Art, and thanks for jumping in. Your Dad was a good man — a great Special Forces trooper and a fine friend. I still miss him.

              • Hi Art,

                Your Dad knew both the Vietnamese soldiers and the Cambodian soldiers in our area were our allies. We as Americans depended a lot on our allied Vietnamese soldiers as well as depended lots on our allied Cambodian soldiers for field operations, night patrol, and guards, both of whom outnumbered we Americans soldiers in Moc Hoa and in Kien Tuong Province.

                From our B-41 Compound, we heard the rifle shots coming from the west, i.e., Moc Hoa Airfield. Cambodians soldiers were firing north from the south in their Cambodian compound, and Vietnamese soldiers were firing south from the Town of Moc Hoa to the north.

                Your Dad was a very compassionate person who cared for others, and in my humble opinion, he did not want anyone on either side, (our allies), to get hurt. After a while, the shooting increased. Your Dad told us he walked across the airfield towards the West to stop the shooting. After the shooting stopped he returned to or B41 Mess Hall to tell Dr. John Goudelock and I he thought he got his with a piece of shrapnel.

                I rode with your Dad a few times in the airboats and fiberglass boats with outboard motors on the Van Co Tay River and on the canal going south down to Ap-Bac where we had a few of both Special Forces and MACV Forces .

                Please let your family and friends know that your Dad was a very kind and very brave person with lots of integrity who was very well respected by all of us.

                Most sincerely,

                Henry L. Chauvin

                • It’s been 51 years this week since SFC Fernandez lost his life. I can still remember him joking around in the club at B41. The loss of this affable man was hard to take for all of us who knew him. RIP, Trooper.

                  • For all who knew or heard of him:

                    One outstanding trait noticed was that ….. even though Sgt. Fernandez was a Special Forces soldier wearing a Green Beret, (just like that of the wonderful SF Sgt. Evans), they both always had very sincere and profound respect for all of us Non-SF, MACV Army enlisted and officer soldiers, & also respected all of our U.S. Naval & Air Force soldiers & other U.S. soldiers in Kien Tuong Province, South Vietnam.

                    We were all blessed to have served with so many wonderful caring American soldiers in our Kien Tuong Province.

                    We can never forget these types 100% truly admiral respectable military friends in arms who never judged soldiers because of military rank ….. or the types of different uniforms that we all wore ……. or our religious preference ….. or political affiliation ……. we were Americans. .

                    • Hi Rick,

                      Yes. I remember many referred to Sgt. Fernandez as Chico.

                      What a brave soldier ….. who all alone ….. risked his life by trying to save lives by attempting to stop this Moc Hoa Village fight between the Cambodian & South Vietnamese soldiers located to the west of our B-41 Compound.

      • Yes, I do remember SFC Fernandez and how he got shot breaking up a fight. Sad story. Also I was there when a SF SSG don’t remember his name unfortunately was preforming H and I fire with the mortar at the B 41 compound and I guess dropped a faulty round down the tube and it exploded right in the motar pit killing him and catching the ammo bunker on fire. Does anyone remember Dallas Padgett who also lost his life on a PBR boat doing recon on one of the narrow tributaries that ran thru the Delta?

        David L. Krzeminski

        • Hi David,

          I don’t remember the mortar accident; must’ve happened after I left in early April ’69. Dallas Padgett’s name is familiar but I’m foggy on any details about him.

          • Yes, it was a long time ago, everything is foggy and getting foggier. I can only remember snippets of certain incidents but have a good memory of the people that I served with that long ago.

  44. Hi Eddie,

    If you obtain no positive reply, do not think that none of us care.

    Usually while in the service, most of us went through different training units, like Basic Training, Advanced Individual Training, possibly NCO Schools, Officer Schools, & after some time we meet & see so many soldiers for short period of time most of us forget names; however, many never forget faces.

    There were also a few other Regular Army & Regular Navy soldiers in units in Kien Tuong Province in 1969 who we never saw or had a chance to meet because we were either MACV Military Advisors or in Special Forces I hope somebody can give more detail, but it may help if you could offer a few more details. Thanks for your very kind remarks — they are most appreciated.


    • Thanks for the reply Henry…by the way…my uncle was in Special Forces and if i can remember correctly, he was also an Advisor….i will have to check on that
      but thanks anyway

  45. Hello. My name is Eddie Horton and I just found this site, and it makes me feel good to read about you guys that were there. I had an uncle that died in Kien Tuong in Mar. 1969. His name was Kyle Waldrop. If this name rings a bell to you guys please post something you might know. Thank you very much and thank you for your service to the United States of America.
    Eddie Horton

  46. Hi Kevin,

    I also remember “why” Colonel Herlein went down that Canal with a small group to the A Team below Ap Bac when he got shot on the return trip — VC ambush round went clean through his neck — while waiting for a Medevac from Moc Hoa he was joking & asking Dr. John Goudelock for a shot of whisky while John was trying to stop the bleeding.

    Dr. John Goudelock was an untiring very hard MACV worker from around New Albany MS. I later visited with him in MS.

    After every mortar attack they headed to the hospital to take care of the wounded VN civilians injured with mortar rounds. John helped so many VN children & brought them back to life with very simple cures — very compassionate individual & a super surgeon. He performed some most successful surgeries that some other doctors would never have tried — he even wrote to the States for Medical Books on difficult surgical procedures & would read them far into the night. The other American doctor did not make this same impression.

    John & I arrived in Moc Hoa & left on the same day — when we first arrived, the first VN doctor was Dr. Phuc, very lazy …. later came Dr. Manh, who worked as hard as John — Dr. Manh asked me in French to tell John that he & his pharmacist wife owned seven (7) pharmacies in Saigon & that they did not need to steal like Dr. Phuc was doing in selling medicine that should be given out for free — we all laughed — Dr. manh was a man of high integrity like my counterpart Engineer Do Dinh Phuc.

    One other guy on the Medical Team was Randy Shotwell — super nice dedicated medic — on some nights he used to put on his dark sun glasses & sing rock & roll & blues songs in the B-41 Club. He did well in the medical field when he returned to the States according to Dr. Goudelock.

    Major Henry airdropped large rubber balls with the South Vietnamese Flag printed on them — when the VC took them away, the children would get mad & hate the VC — for VN adults, they air dropped flag-printed toilet paper rolls — when the VC took them away, same same..

    I responded to Jim Doyle’s email with an email & photo attachments; but when I copied you with the 103@comcast email address, it bounced back.

    Please send me you email address.


  47. Hi Henry,

    I remember Goudelock well. We were assigned the same hooch (unlike Jim, I was able to stay at the SF compound my entire tour). I remember that he had a tough, tough schedule and spent a lot of time at the Vietnamese hospital. He did a lot to save Heirlen’s life when he was wounded. There was another LT in the hooch who worked for Driscoll in the S-3 and I can’t remember his name for the life of me. He had gone to Australia for R & R, met someone, divorced his wife and, I believe, he was going to marry the Australian. He extended his tour and was still there when I left. He wore an “ear necklace”. Wasn’t Goudelock from Mississippi? There was another doctor and someone from the MSC who was a hospital administrator type. I liked all of the medical team.

    I didn’t know about the interrogation. Goudelock was definitely a doctor first when he did not allow the SF to drag the NVA soldier out of the hospital. He did do the right thing.

    You’re right. Henry was a good guy. Officially, I think he was S-5. I remember he always went up with the Army FO in his O-1 and dropped leaflets throughout the province. I am not sure how much good the leaflets did since no one ever surrendered to me.

    You got me in the mood. I am doing a class on Vietnam in September and I had better get back doing the prep work.

    Take care and have a great 4th.


  48. Hi Kevin,

    Every time you guys mention something about Moc Hoa, for me it is like opening up an old book with dust on it & turning to a story or comment on a particular page & it all comes back to me in detail.

    I remember the FAC that was there for a long time when I was there — a perfect gentleman.

    I also remember General Abrams was a former Armor Officer.

    After he took over & first came to Moc Hoa, we all knew he was coming. First a group of helicopters circled Moc Hoa & the air field for about 5 minutes. Then a second group of helicopters came in & landed at the Moc Hoa Airfield. Never saw so many helicopters in one day.

    Both SF LTC Herlein & MAVC LTC Terrel were completely shocked & totally pissed because General Abrams did not come to our B-41 Compound to visit with them — he went to the U. S. Embassy compound further down the street to meet with the civilians guys who had the tall Chinese Soldiers from the Saigon Cholon Area who wore black scarfs with a skull & cross bones on their scarfs. These taller soldiers of Chinese origin were authorized to eliminate or kill any Vietnamese who they even “thought” was a VC or a spy.

    I used to visit the Embassy Compound sometimes at night with our U. S. MACV doctor; i.e., Dr. John Goudelock. John refused SF from questioning a wounded North Vietnamese soldier after the civilians at the Embassy questioned him & the North Vietnamese soldier passed out. SF sent for a SF Medic from Can Tho to demand release from the Moc Hoa Hospital — they brought the NVA soldier to B-41 in a room next to my sleeping room near the two (2) masonry water tanks, & across from the Mess Hall.

    SF and the South Vietnamese questioned him until about 3:00 a.m. the following morning until he died — I could not sleep — he was tortured & screaming often — I thought this was so cruel.

    Anyway, the straw that broke the camel’s back was that General Abrams met with U. S. Embassy Civilians, one of which was a former sergeant in the Marines, (I think Marines), & not even an Officer. I think these civilians put a bug in General Abrams ear that every time a VC or North Vietnamese was captured, it was an in-house war to see “who” would interrogate him & get “brownie points” for sending juicy news to higher headquarters.

    Not much later, General Abrams made a second trip to Moc Hoa shortly thereafter & opened up a big can of Whip-Ass on our B-41 SF Commander & our LTC Team 85 MACV Commander.

    The IG came not too long after the dust settled. I had already given up on getting R & R and (7) day leave until the IG came — remember I scheduled & I took both R&R and Leave at the end of my tour in August 1968.

    Remember the lady who cleaned the Boa Snake cage every day — have pictures of him eating a live, whole chicken.

    Also remember MACV Major Henry — very nice & courteous black gentleman from the French Side & French District of the Virgin Isles — wasn’t he in PSYOPS?

    Back to work!


  49. Hi Henry/Dave/Jim,

    It is great to see this board so active. Dave, see what you started.

    Jim, welcome. We just had a former Vietnam War POW address our local veterans’ group, BG Jon Reynolds (USAF Retired). He was not only a great speaker but a really good guy. He was a FAC on his first Vietnam tour.

    I knew the two FACs who were in Moc Hoa before your tour. I really liked both of them. The Air Force was more civilian than the Army and I always felt that I was a civilian on temporary assignment to the Army. We were promoted faster in the Army than you guys since we were better looking, smarter and more “John Wayne-ish”. The major AF FAC retired when he finished his tour and went on to teach at a college, somewhere in Tennessee – I think. The LT I thought was still there when I DROSed in late June, 1969. The were both “nice guys” and did not get kicked out of the SF compound. Henry did not mention it, but he was the guy that brought us running water and decreased our body oder by about 90%.

    You may have piloted me on one of my flights. We lived in Florida and Atlanta for a while. Also, I spent a lot of time on NWA when we were in Minneapolis and Ann Arbor, MI. When you mentioned that you had a co-pilot who found ‘Snuffy’, it further proves that it is a small, small world.

    Henry, good to see you on the board again. You did not mess around on whom you chose to complain about no R & R. He was pretty effective in getting you out of country. Do you remember what month that was? General Abrams came to Moc Hoa in January, 1969. We were all prepared to brief him – both MACV and SF. Instead of the briefing, he kicked us all out and laced into Terrell and Heirlein for acting like a couple of kids who could not get along and thought that both of their time could be better spent doing something about the infiltration of NVA than arguing. I thought that the IG may have been there to follow up on Abrams trip.

    Dave, take care and enjoy Michigan. Were the fireworks last weekend? The Detroit/Windsor fireworks were one of the best I have seen. They may have been cancelled because of the financial condition of both cities.

    Gentlemen, again it great to see activity on the board. Have a great 4th of July.


    • Hi Kevin,

      I remember an Air Force FAC pilot — MAJ Beneze, and his crew chief was named Chapman, I think. Great guys! Also had two Army L19 pilots, Capt Jerry Gouge was Swamp Fox 14 and I don’t remember Swamp Fox 15’s name, but also a good guy.

      • Hi Bruce! I am Capt Gouge’s daughter. I would love to learn more or see any pictures that you may have of my dad. Thank you!

        • Hello Teresa! I’m not sure that I have any pictures of your Dad but I do remember him very well. After I left Vietnam I went to the 15th MI Battalion at Ft. Bragg, NC. A few months later your Dad showed up as a company commander of a different company than mine. I shocked him one day by calling him “Swamp Fox 14.” Please tell me he is still with us.

            • Teresa, I am truly sorry to learn that he passed away. I’ll always remember him as a warm, friendly man who was good at his job. I remember going out to light the runway for him when we got mortared in the middle of the night. He took off in full darkness but we would light the corners to bring him home.

              • Thank you for lighting those corners! We were able to spend many years with him after this war ended due to the sacrifices and hard work of so many. God Bless!

  50. Hi Jim,

    Keep saying I remember faces but really I remember few names.

    Any way, glad to hear from you Jim.

    I remember the day LTC Beck’s helicopter got blown up. As Engineer Advisor to the Kien Tuong Province Chief Engineer Do Dinh Phuc, we were aware of the “Top Secret” mines being air dropped between Moc Hoa & the Cambodian Border.

    Our Kien Tuong Province/Cambodian border was at the end of the protected Ho Chi Minh trail.

    Most VC supplies going to Mid & South IV Corps Vietnam came through Kien Tuong Province. These air dropped mines were on trial & were supposed to impede VC supplies & VC replacement forces.

    There were other helicopters flying with the one LTC Beck was on. When they came back to Moc Hoa airfield, a helicopter pilot told me that LTC Beck wanted to see some of the air dropped mines. LTC beck kept asking the helicopter pilot to get down closer. This area was covered with thick reeds, (Plain of Reeds — in French, “La Plaine des Joncs), According to the other pilot, the reeds started whipping with the wind force of the helicopter blades & set off what was thought to be an anti-tank mine. They said his helicopter bounced upwards & was totally in flames before it hit ground. So sad, Nobody wanted to go down in the thick reeds to see if there were any survivors because they landed in a very dangerous “un-charted” mine field.

    NATO requires that normal Allied minefields be “charted” with mines measured & drawn to rough scale on a Map, measured in foot-steps so that they could be disarmed & removed later. These Top Secret air dropped mines had built in acid which was supposed to disarm them in a few years so no maps were drawn.

    When I left Vietnam I continued to write to my counter-part in French — everybody in our office could speak, read, & write French. I spoke French every day with all of them & all of the Vietnamese Officials & Vietnamese military officers in Kien Tuong.

    Below Saigon was the Cochine China part of French Indochina known as “Cochin-Chine” which was a French Colony with the capitol in Saigon. Vietnamese born in Cochin-Chine prior to 1948 had dual citizenship — France & Vietnam. Central Vietnam was a Kingdom with Bao-Dai as King who much later died in France — the capitol was Hue. North Vietnam was a French Protectorate with the capitol in Hanoi.

    My Vietnamese counter-part Do Dinh Phuc later came to the US in late April of 1975 with three(3) baby sons & his wife with the “Boat People”. He was born in North Vietnam near Dien Bien Phu on the Red River. I worked in & out of his office every day — he gave me a desk adjacent to his. He was a very intelligent educated graduate engineer from University of Saigon. (He later received his Masters Degree at University of CA — all A’s)

    As a Catholic, he left Communist North Vietnam & escaped to South Vietnam by boat with the famous American Doctor Tom Dooley who evacuated many Catholics in the mid 1950’s. This escape to the US was his second escape.

    Do changed his name in the US to Peter Do. One son, Pat is an Orthopedic Surgeon in Kansas city with a family. The baby son is a Doctor of Internal Medicine, with a family, still in Orange County, CA — he is in charge of a large hospital with about 1,000 doctors under him. The middle son was doing well in Real Estate.

    His father invited us to go to his youngest son’s wedding in CA. At the reception of about 300 Vietnamese where we were the only Americans, the father got up & started “chanting” like the Vietnamese did in Vietnam at very special ceremonies. Everybody was quiet as he spoke in this auditorium.

    I started crying because in every paragraph he mentioned my name — Trung Uy Chauvin, i.e., Lieutenant Chauvin — my wife saw my tears & asked, “What is he talking about?” — I was able to barely say he was talking about me & how I helped & worked with his people in Vietnam.

    When he finished, he looked at me & smiled & asked me to stand. All 300 Vietnamese stood up & clapped — I was speechless & could not utter one word. if I live to be 1,000 I will never forget his smile.

    Peter had named his youngest Doctor son Henry — after me.

    Peter Do later died & we went to CA where the family asked me to be a pallbearer & give the eulogy — he always called me his brother.

    We are still friends with his children.

    Could go on & on, but getting late — most of America never knew & still will never know what Vietnam was like when we were there.


  51. Hi David,

    In August 68 they first incorrectly sent me to Team 84 in Cai-Lai, Kien Phong Province.

    The Commander was a LTC Special Forces Engineer Branch Officer named Callahan — I was engineer branch also — he had no idea who sent me to Team 84 so as an Engineer officer, he made me an Infantry Advisor to a Vietnamese infantry Unit out in the boonies — not a soul could speak English & the departing US Infantry Advisor Fremont from New York had gone to language school at FT. Benning — he left in a couple of days so I spoke French every day ….. all day & all night.

    Later, USAiD from Moc Hoa called Calahan & told him to send me to Moc Hoa.

    On the day I arrived in Moc Hoa in an Air America Helio airplane, I sat on the runway for about an hour before a USAID Vietnamese employee picked me up & brought me to the USAiD office.

    Mr. White, State Department Foreign Officer 0-4 brought me to meet SF Commander LTC Herlein & the then MACV Commander, ( before LTC Terrell) — (cannot remember his name). Mr. white told both commanders he knew I was military but if Special Forces gave me an order, and/or if the MACV Commander gave me an order, & if Mr. white gave me an order ………….. that I was to follow Mr. Whites’s orders.

    From then on I never had any problems with anybody. I stayed in the B-41 Compound for the entire year.

    I was assigned a room with an Army pilot who flew an Army Bird Dog Plane every day. i cannot remember his name — he was an American but said he was born in Morocco when his American Dad & Mom were stationed there.

    He gave me one of his extra Smith & Wesson’s .38 caliber pistols from his predecessor pilot with a leather holster that could be carried as a concealed weapon. I wore that concealed .38 S & W every day & never told a soul — when I left I gave it to the new MACV S-! in August 1969 — this MACV S-1 was a real super guy — he told me he put me in for a Bronze Star which I received later in the States.

    I remember the mortar pit accident. Very sad. I think SF SGT Evans was in charge of the mortar ammo stored in the B-41 compound surrounded by sand bags. SGT Evans was one of the best SF Sgts. I ever met — very level headed & intelligent.


  52. Hi Kevin,

    Late responding also.

    In July of 69 I kept applying for R & R & also 7 days leave but was always denied same in Can Tho for some excuse..

    About mid July 69 I went to the airfield to coordinate work on the airfield when a Lieutenant Colonel got off of a helicopter by himself. I took my jeep & drove over to pick him up.

    Found out he was an Army Inspector General, IG, coming to visit Team 85 & B-41 Special Forces. Took him to B-41 where the B-41 S-1 told him to go to the USAID compound where he might have an “air-conditioned” room to sleep.

    Went to USAID where they told him he could sleep in an extra air-conditioned trailer out back facing the air-field. I carried his duffle bag to the trailer. Then he asked me what did I think. I told him I personally would not try to sleep here. I told him we were getting mortared often & that I would stay in the B-41 Compound with soldiers as opposed to with USAID civilians. I told him my B-41 roommate went on R & R & his bunk was empty but no air-conditioning. He looked around for about 15 minutes & asked to go to B-41.

    Well, we got mortared at midnight — USAID was hit bad — next morning I went to the USAID Compound to find that all (4) tires on their Land-Rover vehicle were flat — Mr. Harry’s bedroom at USAID received a mortar round that collapse his sand bag bed on top of him — and the “air-conditioned” trailer was full of shrapnel holes.

    Went back to B-41 to get the IG LTC to show him what would have happened if he would have stayed in the USAID “air-conditioned” trailer. (Still have pictures of USAID Land-Rover & trailer.)

    Later that night in the B-41 club he came to thank me for the advice & asked if I needed help with anything — I told him about no R & R & no 7 day leave — he called Can Tho the next morning & found out some soldier was illegally selling R & R’s & 7 day leaves & that mine were sold to somebody else. In about 15 minutes he got everything straight after checking with the MACV S-1 — first went to Hong Kong for 7 days R & R , & later Japan for 7 days leave — then after about 1-1/2 weeks in Moc Hoa left to return to the “Land of the Big PX”, USA.

    Glad to here you are doing better.


  53. Hi David,

    Trying to play “Catch-Up’ to all of these MACV messages. I remember SGT Watson 7 SGT. Hughes.

    I always went to the same B-41 Compound south-east corner bunker, farthest away from the front street, Cong-Hoa Boulevard.

    Every time we had a mortar attack, mostly either at mid-night or at 3:00 a.m., Sgt Watson would come to the bunker limping with sandals on instead of boots because his feet were hurting. He was a very kind person a very compassionate person who always appeared to try his best to help anyone.

    One night after a mortar attack it got so hot in that small concrete bunker, we all stepped outside to cool off — one of the Special Forces Officer asked Sgt. Watson what would he do without boots if we had to evacuate the B-41 Compound.

    Sgt. Watson said he would not run away ….. he would stay in the B-41 Compound & Parry right & Parry left like that in bayonet training & just push the mortar rounds away to the right or to the left — he was motioning with his hands and arms to show how he would do it.

    Instead of the Special Forces Officer laughing with the rest of us MACV guys he got mad & told all of us we were idiots.


  54. Hi Kevin,

    Now that you say S-1 – Graves, I remember he was known as Captain “Bud” Graves.– real nice gentleman — appears all of the MACV guys got along with each other.


  55. Hi David,

    I had gone to some of the MAT Teams & Special Forces A Teams away from Moc Hoa but still in Kien Tuong Province when I was a Class A Agent with the Army payroll paying soldiers in about the month of October 1968.

    We were so few American soldiers between Special Forces & MACV that with the helicopter assignment, one could pay all Americans soldiers in Kien Tuong Province in one (1) day.

    Pay roll was picked up at the Air Field in Can Tho — the Finance Offices were in several Army GP medium tents.

    As the selected October Class A agent I had not gotten paid since I arrived in Vietnam in August 1968. I told the Finance Officer in Can Tho I was not leaving Can Tho until I got paid. They looked for my pay records in the Officer Files for about (2) hours.

    Then I asked them to maybe check the enlisted files because I had gone through Basic Training & AIT training at Fort Leonard Wood, MO; & OCS Engineer School at Fort Belvoir, VA, as an enlisted soldier.

    There was my file …… with the enlisted files —– had quite a wad of cash while in Moc Hoa.

    Later in the Reserves, I went to Kaiserslautern three (3) times — even lived in Detroit a short while in 1966 before joining the Army — Joined at Fort Wayne, Detroit October 26, 1966 — looks like we crossed paths a few times.


  56. Hi Scott,

    I was there in B-41 August 68 to August 69.

    I remember when the Navy came to Moc Hoa. As the Kiien Tuong Province Military Engineer Officer Advisor, I had to get an LUC signed, i.e., Land Use Concurrence between the then Province Chief Colonel Ly Troung My, the U. S. Navy, & our local State Department Official Mr. White with USAID.

    I suggested the Navy dock on the north, (Cambodian), side of the Vam Co Tay River & place that high chain-link fence on the same north side to repel any incoming mortars aimed at their boats..

    The navy lost almost all of their initial soldiers in a short time while on patrol on their PBR’s, Patrol Boat Riverine.

    One night while on all night TOC duty, Tactical Operations Duty in the B-41 Special Forces Compound , I received a call fro a U. S. Helicopter Patrol Unit operating further south near Ap Bac asking if the VC had such long & large boats — I told then negative — then I called the Navy on their frequency to ask them to shine a light on their American Flag — the Navy boat guy said he was about to ask me if the VC had helicopters because they were shining lights on their boats.

    Maybe appears funny now ….. but it was not too funny for the Navy back then.

    Wonderful to hear you are OK.

    Henry L. Chauvin.

  57. Hi Jim, glad you found the site. I knew Major Hamrick pretty well because I worked in the S-1. I didn’t know that he didn’t make it back. I left Aug 22, 1969 must of happened after I left. Sure sorry to here that. Talking about the Special Forces group at B-41. They sure were not that hospitable. They were elite for sure and sometimes acted like they wern’t part of the same army. I remember that they tried to feed a puppy to that snake and that just didn’t seem right to me so I stood in and said that wasn’t going to happen. I expected a big blow-out. After a brief stare-down and some choice words the puppy eventually became an adult. Feed the snake chickens, not dogs. Do you remember the 1SGT’s name you mentioned in the SF group? When we arrived in August of 68,(there were 5 of us. Team#85). We were not allowed to stay at B-41 because we were not SF types. They only relented when the Advisory Team and Air Force and engineers began showing up to upgrade the area. Especially when they re-did the runways. We were motored alot between April and August of 69. One of the motors went thru the roof of the mess hall and embedded itself into the mess halls floor but didn’t explode. I guess on of the SF dug it out of the cement without it exploding, thank God. Were you there when the SF’s were firing H & I fire from the 4.duce motor and one of the round was a defective round and it exploded in the tube? I don’t remember his name, but boy there wasn’t much left of him. That was horrible. What a way to go, for defective equipment. Well, again glad to have you with us again Jim. Hope all is going well with you now in the real world. Keep in contact.

    David L. Krzeminski

    • Dave,

      The name of the first shirt was CMSgt Schlegal. (You can look up a lot of history regarding B-41 members at… ) I take it you were there when LtCBeck and Capt. Geneseo plus the helo crew bought it hunting sampans up by the Parrots Beak? I managed to find the wreck…or what was left which was the tail rotor….while flying around the Provence that pm. Do you remember LtC Lindig who replaced Beck? I was there when the SF Sgt. blew himself up with the mortar round. All I remember is the mortar pit was painted white for some strange reason and it was almost totally red the next morning. I also remember H&I fire at 0100 ceased after that incident. Met Col Terrell once. Really nice man, too bad I did not have an excuse to visit him often as he sure had a neat “villa” down the street. I am well and thanks for asking. Left the Air Force after my 5 year tour and have been blessed over the years. Oh…before I forget…I did meet Snuffy (the snake) “father”. When I was flying 727 Flt Engineer as a new hire at Delta in 74 I got to talking with a Copilot who had been an Army 0-1 pilot at Moc Hoa and had captured a baby snake on a ground op he joined onto one afternoon for “fun”. His name was Lt. Boyce Cates, he named the snake Snuffy and was thrilled to hear Snuffy had grown so large and popular. Take care and continue with the great stories.

      Jim Doyle
      aka Bomber 32

  58. Hi Kevin: Funny how your Hong Kong suite fell apart at absolutely the wrong time. But if things didn’t happen that way in life we wouldn’t have anything to laugh about. You mentioned the Church you attended a wedding in, in Hamtramck MI. The name of that Church is St. Florians and was built in 1901 by Polish immigrants from the bottom up, it took 7 years. I graduated from that high school in 1964, and that Church is now a Michigan Historical site. You also mentioned MSG Watson. I believe that he only did a half tour in Moc Hoa and then was sent back to Saigon for medical reasons. Then MSG Hughes took over for the last 3 months that I was there, you mentioned that you didn’t remember him. I remember a SSG Smith he was part of the orginal 5 member team 85 that was created in Bien Hoa, VN in Sept of 68. We went to 3 weeks of traning in Bien Hoa and were then sent to Moc Hoa. We we arrived there was nothing there but a Special Forces Camp B-41, and they didn’t let us stay there with them. We stayed with the South Vietnamese RF/PF forces about 1/2 mile away. Other than myself and SSG Smith the other members of the team were SFC Knutson, SSG Trawick and SP4 Justis. I sorry to here that you were not feeling well since I talked with you last. Hope thing are getting better for you. Well I’ll leave you to mull over all that important infor I gave you, trying to figure out who was who. I’ll be talking with you soon.

    Dave Krzeminski

    • Dave,

      Just found this website. Thought I’d jump in and say hello and “Welcome Home” to all you gentlemen. I was one of the USAF FAC’s flying Bird Dogs. We were attached to B-41 when I arrived in July of 69. Lost my boss, Maj Hamrick (Bomber 30) shortly after I arrived. Then I replaced Lt .Dave Burke (Bomber 31) and became the lone FAC…Bomber 32 for a couple of months. Then the Sgt. Major at B-41 thought he’d take advantage of a new louie so he attempted to draft my Crew Chief, Sgt Pat “Pappy” Thompson and two radio operators into his middle of the night Gate Guard staff. My protests lent to our Air Force team being “extracted” from B-41 on Christmas day to Cao Lanh until the MACV Compound was completed in early 1970. I lived there and roomed with Lt. Loren Nett and Capt. Carlton Schnieder until leaving in late April, 1970. It is very interesting reading you guys memories from your tours of duty. By the way, the PSP Runway was replaced because C-130’s were too heavy and kept tearing up the strip. They installed Aluminum which was slipperier than owl snot on wet days. Sure made it fun watching the Caribou and C-123 landings! The most vicious fighting I recall was two guys in the B-41 Bar one night over a duck they fed to the snake “Snuffy”. Also had some real missions that were particularly nasty at Cai Cai and Long Khot. Then there was the donnybrook that was a real goatrope at the “Hump” which lasted from Oct. 1 to Oct. 4 1969. Plus the weekly VC Mortar Missions. Moc Hoa was a charming slice of #@**#! I’m glad all who are reading this survived.

      aka Bomber 32

  59. Hi Kevin: I’m glad you mentioned CPT Graves, I forgot about him. Now that you reminded me of him, I remember him as being a real nice guy. The 2 S-1 Sargents were SGT Watson, he had real bad feet from his alchololism, they would burn him like crazy. Most of the time he would just lie in his bunk and I would run the orderly room. When there was something that I thought I couldn’t handle I would go to the hootch and ask him what to do. Actually I went to Hong Kong on R and R with him. We spent 10 days there in a drunken’ stupor. Don’t remember much so I guess we had a good time. When he left he was replaced by a MSG Hughes, good guy but I was closer to SGT Watson. Well if you lived in Michigan for 21 years you probably heard of Hamtramck. That’s the town I lived in when I got drafted and then joined back in 1966. After I got out of the Army I lived in Detroit proper for 14 years till my house got robbed a few times, then we moved to a city called Clawson, MI. it’s between Royal Oak and Troy. Around 14 mile road and Crooks. I currently reside in this same town. But now I spend 7 months of the year in Florida.

    I’ll be talking with you soon

    Dave Krzeminski

    • Hey Dave,

      Sorry that I have taken so long to respond.  I picked up a few health issues and have not been responding to emails for the last few weeks.

      I remember that all of the local TV stations broadcast from a bakery in your hometown on Paczki Day the week before lent started.  I went to a wedding in Hamtram ck about 15 – 20 years ago and I remember that the church was nice.    I remember where Claw son is and I drove through it a few times.  It seemed like a nice town.  I am not sure that I could have lived in Detroit like you.  Although I did enjoy the Lions, Tigers and the Fox Theater.

      Was Sgt. Watson an E-8 who transferred to MACV Hqs. in Saigon about half way through his tour.  I didn’t remember that he was alcoholic .  I remember that LTC. Terrell was.  I can’t remember MSG Hughes and I don’t know why I don’t.  I also liked Sgt. Watson a lot. 

      Do you remember SSG. Smith or SP4 Bailey?  They were both good guys.  Bailey was really a hard worker.  He extended and joined the Team in September/October, 1968.  I think that I previously mentioned before that he died in the 2001/2002 timeframe.  He was down to about 75-80 lbs. and did not know why.  He had been living in Oklahoma before he died.  He had been originally from Ohio – Columbus, I think.

      I ended up in Hong Kong for R & R too.  It was a wild time.  I did get a suit and a sports coat and slacks made there.   I must have taken them back to Vietnam with me.   After R & R, I only had 3 months to go before DROS.  I remember giving a presentation at work when I was wearing the sports jacket.  My right sleeve fell off.  One of the many embarrassing moments I have had in life.  

      Are you like most Midwesterners who end up on the west coast of Florida?   We lived in Ft. Lauderdale and Ormond Beach for about 4 years.  I do miss Florida.  My wife never liked living there.   It is a good way to avoid Michigan winters.  

      What did you do for a living when you got back to Michigan?

      I better rest my fragile mind and end this.

      Take care and have a great weekend.


  60. Hi David,

    It’s great to see another Michigander on the board. I spent 21 years in Ann Arbor and loved it before we moved to Delaware in 2010. I feel I can be considered a Michigander based on my time there. Welcome to the board.

    I was the S-4. Do you remember Durus (Beatle) Bailey? He found me in the mid 90s (after 30+ years) and asked for help with a PTSD claim. Durus said that his hooch in the new MACV compound was hit by mortars in August, 1968. At the time , the VA was only approving PTSD claims for people who were in either Army or Marine infantry units. I wrote a letter on his behalf about how his (our) situation of experiencing frequent mortar attacks and gaining frequent flyer “gold status” from our helicopter flights. He eventually was diagnosed 100% disabled due to PTSD. He sent me a shipment of Omaha steaks as a thank you for my letter. We stayed in contact until about 2002 when he died. He was only about 85 lbs. at that time. Durus really wanted to have a reunion for the Team. If the way he tracked me down is indicative of his bloodhound skills, he would have found all of us. He also found Terrell who was the LTC who commanded us.

    Our memories are not as great as they should be. My deficiencies in memory are most probably caused by the $.25 drinks at the SF club. I think I remember the name of the S-1 – Graves (?). I remember the MSG who ran the S-1 function but I don’t really remember his name. He transferred to MACV Hqs. in February/March. I don’t remember who replaced him. I really liked the E-8. He was a sharp and interesting guy. I remember that we had a good group of NCOs and enlisted men and a few pretty good officers in Team 85. Also, the intelligence types were pretty nice. I do remember dropping a few dollars to them on Saturday night playing card at the “Embassy”. I should have know better to play cards with an “Agriculture Advisor” from NYC. I liked a lot of the SF types too. There was a Staff Sargent Smith that I also worked with who was wounded in a mortar attack and Medevaced to Japan and then he was sent back to the States. I think that they medically discharged him upon his return to the States.

    I loved the M-2 carbine. We were issued those before the RF/PF received M-16s. I also had a 45 pistol. You mentioned you weapons trained the province RF/P.

    Where do you live in the Detroit metro?

    Sorry if there are any typos. I am really no up to proofreading this.

    Take care,


  61. Hi Scott: I am not familiar with MAT 114. Maybe I had left by the time that unit was created. Or maybe it was a continuation of MACV Tm# 85, it just doesn’t ring a bell. When I left in Aug of 69 a Major Driscoll was in charge of the S-1 which was located in the B-41 Special Forces compound. And a Major Hamrick was the FAC pilot, I beleive he got killed after I left. Anyways I extended 2 week in Vietnam so I would have less than 150 days left in the service so I could get an early out. Prior to Vietnam I was stationed in Kaiserslautern, Germany for 2 years. I am for the Detroit area orginally and still live here. I am retired now and share my time between Detroit and The Villages, Florida. I also took quite a few pictures while I was there and still have them in a album. Maybe I could get your address and if you would like I could make copies of the pictures and send some to you. Thanks for responding to me and I’ll be waiting for other communications from yourself and other members of the Advisory Group.

    David L. Krzeminski

  62. Hi David,

    Like you, I was there in MACV Team 85 from August 68 to August 69 as a First Lieutenant Combat Engineer Advisor to the Vietnamese Engineers & advisor to the Moc Hoa Civilian Public Works Department …. Ty Cong Chanh ………. with Vietnamese Engineer Do Dinh Phuc, who was in charge of roads, bridges, air field maintenance, Moc Hoa water supply & Moc Hoa electricity. He later came to the US with his wife & three (3) young sons with the “Boat People” at the end of April , 1975.

    MACV S-1 Captain’s first name was Bud, can’t recall his last name at this moment.
    I forget names but never faces. I do remember MSG Watson & MSG Hughes & both were regular visitors of the B-41 Bar like many of us …… for some reason, also remember DeLuna..

    Not too long before I left, we got a new MACV S-1 officer … can picture him but cannot remember his name …. very nice person.

    We had two (2) pilots, one (1) Army & one Air Force with their Bird dong Observation Planes … also had a naval officer.

    I got called into the reserves after I left Vietnam & spent 29 years total in the Army …… too many names to remember.

    I can even picture the Vietnamese barber who used to come in our B-41 compound to give us haircuts, but cannot remember his name either.

    We are just lucky to still be here to talk about it.

    Thanks for sharing,


  63. Hi everyone, my name is SP5 David L. Krzeminski and I was stationed in B-41 and part of Advisory Team #85 from August 68 to August 69. I think I was part of the original 5 member team trained in Di An outside of Saigon for 3 weeks in early August of 68. The members of the team were, myself, SFC Knutson, SSG Smith, SSG Trawick and SP4 Justis. I was orginally trained as a small arms specialist to the Regional/Popular Forces, local forces that would protect the villages that they lived in. I trained them to use WWII vintage weapons such as the M1 Garand, M1 carbine and the BAR. After 4 months of that, I was made the S1 (Orderly Room) clerk under MSG Watson and then under MSG Hughes. I worked with SP4 Quasius and between the two of us we kind of ran the orderly room. Other people that I remember were PFC DeLuna and SP4 Papas. It was kind of quiet when we arrived in Moc Hoa. We originally were housed about 1/2 mile away from B-41 in a South Vietnamiese billet area that compromised 2 small room for 5 of us. As time went on more and more people and units arrived in Moc Hoa and things got busy there. Espeically the engineer battalion that extended and PSP’ed the runway. I also remember the Moc Hoa advisor, the fellow who would sit in a little makeshift tower with a radio and give wind direction to the incomming air traffic. I believe his name was Christopher Johnson. During that period of time I was the guy that would take a Huey to Can Tho to pick up DEROS orders and bring them back to Moc Hoa for the fellows to be able to DEROS back to the States.Oh yeah, I also remember Major Hamrick who was a FAC pilot. We also had a few civilians, intelligence types stationed there that were part of the Phoenix Program. Things are a little foggy, but I’m surprised that I remember the thing and people that I did. Hopefully this information with get thru to somebody and will illicit a response.

    • Welcome, David. I am amazed that you and Henry Chavez can remember so many names. I think I could do the faces but certainly not the names. I was team leader for MAT 114 located in a small prefab across from the navy facility in 1969 and 1970. Lately I have tried desperately to remember things about Moc Hoa and the tour, but only a few mental snapshots come back. I did take a lot of pictures but lost them in a divorce a few years after returning. I actually enjoyed the diversity of daily activity but felt very guilty for leaving my team in the field. I didn’t want to go, but the colonel sent a chopper to get me and I was in Can Tho later that day. I returned to Ft. Benning for around 18 months and then left the service. Looking back, I should have stayed in but my wife didn’t quite fit military life. Thank you for the contact. I am hoping that some of the old team members get on sometime. I’d like to know how they are faring now. Damn, I wish that I had your memory but events may have blocked it all. Scott Bogert Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2014 14:18:54 +0000 To:

    • David, John DeLuna (San Antonio) and Tony Pappas (Chicago) were two of my best friends towards the end of my tour. Any chance you’ve been able to contact either of them? I was in San Antonio once and looked up John in the phone book — there must have been hundreds of John DeLunas in there.

  64. Hi Kevin,

    I could have missed something happening to PFC Padgett because sometimes MACV, SF, or USAID Foreign Officer 0-4 Mr. Richard White or his assistant Mr. Harry Johnson would send me off on different Combat Engineer missions away from Moc Hoa, so I was not there 100% of the time every day.

    Sometimes I was sent by SF to spend the day & night at small bridge guard posts along the canal adjacent to Highway #29 — VC were blowing up our bridges often.

    Spent two (2) weeks down south and west in the village of Nhon-Ninh with a Vietnamese surveyor, Mr. Chung — first night after pitching my pup tent, just before dark, some VC kid threw a live hand grenade in my pup tent & ruined (2) cases of canned C-rations — holes all through the tent caused by shrapnel — luckily I was not in the tent yet — spent the next (2) weeks without eating until a Vietnamese Captain picked me up (2) weeks later in a sampan — the Village had a diet of rice cooked with field rats caught on the Plain of Reeds — had no appetite for such.

    Spent a few nights down at Ap Bac. One MACV sergeant had about 10 kids — he told me he slept in the MACV concrete bunker every night because he wanted to live to see his wife & 10 kids again. Later, one night in a mortar attack, he came to the bunker’s front entrance & was killed when he took a direct hit by a mortar — for about (2) weeks, the MACV S-1 told me letters came in to him every day from one of each of the 10 children and/or wife — so sad — he was such a respectable gentleman soldier.

    Not too much was said or discussed about our American casualties. Maybe it was thought that such things could be expected — have no idea — never saw a newsman in Moc Hoa.

    I remember when LTC Herlein was shot through the neck below Ap Bac while traveling in a boat with an outboard motor. He was brought back to Moc Hoa & loaded on a Medivac helicopter by Dr. John Goudelock — we never heard any more.

    His LTC replacement went in a helicopter about a mile north of Moc Hoa to try to see the new Top Secret self-destructive mines recently placed along the Cambodian border — his helicopter came down so close to the mines, the wind turbulence moved the grass so fiercely it set off an anti-tank mine & blew the helicopter up in the air — nobody went to retrieve his body because it landed in an unrecorded airdropped minefield.

    Remember SF S-4 Captain Weatherall who was going down to Ap Bac on Route #29 when his jeep was blown up by a VC who set off a mine with a battery. A medevac helicopter picked him up to bring him to Can Tho — never heard anything about him either.

    Had an Engineer Lt. friend from OCS at Fort Belvoir come by to Moc Hoa from Saigon to record numbers of bridges in Kien Tuong Province. He left, stopped at a bridge below Moc Hoa, measured it, got back in his helicopter & according to the Vietnamese soldier guards at the bridge, the helicopter pilot took off & turned too sharp. When the helicopter was sideways, it had no lift & plunged in the Vam Co Tay River. VN guards said the helicopter immediately sank & nobody came up — they said they tried to dive but the water was too deep for them to dive deeper.

    All seems like yesterday to me.


  65. Hi Dennis,

    Saw your post about PFC Padgett who was shot by small arms fire in Moc Hoa in January 06, 1969, who according to another article on the internet was a member of the MACV Medical Team in Moc Hoa.

    I don’t remember names very well , but hardly ever forget faces. Saw no photo of Padgett & cannot remember the name — If a photo was available, or more details, might remember him — also remember many Vietnamese medical personnel from back then.

    I was a 26 year old Lieutenant Engineer Advisor in MACV Team 85 who stayed in the B-41 Special Forces Compound for about a year prior leaving in August 1969. All American soldiers in Moc Hoa slept in this one (1) compound on Cong Hoa Boulevard from 1968-1969 — MACV Team 85 moved down the street in either late 1969 or early 1970.

    The American Medical Doctor for all Americans in the Province from August 1968-August 1969 was Doctor John Goudelock from Mississippi — he & I arrived in Moc Hoa just about the same day & left just about the same day — appears he would remember Padgett because all medical personnel worked at the primitive Moc Hoa hospital down the street.

    In September 1969 Dr. Goudelock had a newspaper article written about him, (on the internet), about how primitive medicine was in Moc Hoa –. people died with abscessed teeth — maggots were applied on wounded Vietnamese soldiers to remove gangrene — true war stories are seldom told — nobody believes them.

    The Vietnamese doctor was Doctor Manh who I visited in Paris, France a couple of years ago — had not seen him in 43 years — found him on the internet — he was a graduate from University of Paris — extremely intelligent individual.

    We were only about 40 Americans in Kien Tuong Province, in B-41 Special Forces & MACV Team 85 with about 44,000 Vietnamese in said province.

    One other medic I remember who worked with Dr. Jonh Goudelock was Randy Shotwell — if you could find either of these (2) guys, they could no doubt assist.



  66. Hello. I’m an old anchor-clanker who is looking for anyone that might have known my cousin, PFC Dallas Padgett, who was attached to Team 85 from Aug 68 until his death on Jan 6, 69. I had spent a summer with him and his family in Bacliff, TX a few years before he joined the Army, and I was in Navy boot camp when he was killed.

    I’ve wondered many times about the place and his few months of duty there. I can see it on Google maps, but I don’t really know what part of the province he was in, or anything about the job he did there. I stumbled on this after checking his record again on the virtual Vietnam Memorial Wall.

    I understand if anyone is uncomfortable speaking about it to an outsider, I might be too, under similar circumstances. My own service was on Oceanographic Survey Units, so I feel I too was the beneficiary of all of your sacrifices, and I will always be thankful for that.

    Welcome home, brothers.

    • Dennis,

      We definitely allow Navy vets on the site. We even had a Navy Lieutenant assigned with us in Moc Hoa. I believe that he was in Naval Intelligence and probably worked with the SEALs and the PBRs. We did have a number of military intelligence and CIA types in the province because of our proximity to Cambodia.

      Henry has a great memory. If he does not remember your cousin, I sure could not. I am sorry to hear that he was killed in Vietnam. Was he Special Forces? I don’t remember any of our team or the SF team being killed between July, 1968 and June, 1969, when I was assigned to Team 85. We had some WIAs. Team 85 suffered heavy casualties in Tet, January/February, 1968 and after Henry and I left in 1969. There was a SF commander severely wounded in March or April, 1969 and a SF commander and a 1 LT killed in August, 1969.

      I hope that you have luck finding something about your cousin.

      Stay well.


  67. Kevin,

    I remember meeting with Colonel Terrell & his staff in late 1968 to look at the plans for the new Team 85 MACV compound drawn by military engineers.

    First, not one of the officers on his staff could read plans.

    Second I told them this was a good plan for an R&R center for soldiers on a beach in Hawaii — but a horrible plan for soldier in a Combat Zone.

    They asked me to mark up my corrections with a red pencil.

    I first added a 6 feet high perimeter earth berm, (levee), with one protruding bunker on each of the four corners whereby there would be a line of sight on the exterior of the perimeter berm to kill VC trying to climb this earth berm laden with concertina wire.

    This levee would also provide protection when the water rose 4-5 feet every 4th year or so in Moc Hoa during our monsoon seasons.

    Next I centrally located the Mess Hall & Latrines & repositioned the mortar pits, generators & ammo supply.

    While under construction, the NCOIC kept coming to see me with construction questions — most of these young soldier guys building this compound had very limited construction experience.

    When I was leaving VN I heard Colonel Terrell tell USAID Mr. White that he would prefer to lose his right arm rather than see me leave.

    The sergeant I spoke to a year later at Fort Sam said very few MACV soldiers survived the mortar attack on this new MACV Team 85 Compound.

    The C-123 Caribou planes would drop off a load of lumber & almost 75% of it would be stolen by morning by the local Vietnamese — same thing happened to the 55 gallon drums of gasoline — all stamped with “CAL-TEX” — ever notice we had no gas station in Moc Hoa — the local Vietnamese always got free U. S. gas from the Moc Hoa airport.


  68. Scot, Hal & Kevin,

    I received copies too.

    I left in August 1969 — flew home to Louisiana, turned TV on, saw film of then MACV Team 85 Commander Ernest P. Terrell riding in a boat powered by an outboard motor, in Cambodia with his interpreter — cannot remember interpreter’s name.

    Found Col. Terrell on internet much later & kept in contact with Colonel Terrell & his wife Aileen until a few years ago — then Col. Terrell died.

    When I left VN in August 1969, airport had just been covered with solid steel decking by 9th Division Engineers, Company B; however, it was later hit with so many 122 mm rockets, with so many holes no planes were coming in.

    About a year later, met a B-41 Special forces sergeant who air-dropped in a field in front of us while I was at a 2 week Army Reserve Summer Camp at Fort Sam Houston.

    He told me the new wood construction Team 85 Compound was attacked after I left & they had many casualties.– VC had a mortar tube set up on the hill at the end of the Cong Hoa Boulevard near the airport. I left right before Team 85 moved into the new compound.

    My counterpart, Do Dinh Phuc died in California; but I keep in touch with his children who are doctors — even went to Paris to visit with Doctor Manh who was at the Moc Hoa Hospital when I left.


    • Hal/Scott/Henry,

      Hal, look what you started. There had not been any comments since October. Henry, great to see you back. I think that the reason there are so few of us registered on this board is because the site mis-numbering Team 85.

      Henry, I also was been DROSed by the time that the new compound was built. I had heard from our supply specialist, Durus Baily back in the late 1990s/early 2000s and he told me about the mortaring of the new compound. His living quarters took a direct hit. We seemed to be hit almost every other night at the SF compound, didn’t we Henry?

      It’s good seeing your posts.

      I am teaching an “old farts” class on “The Sixties” this semester. We had one class on Vietnam and it did bring back a lot of memories. I had a former AF Caribou pilot present in the Vietnam class. Before they extended the runway, Caribous, Beavers, Otters and Bird Dogs were the only fixed wing aircraft that could land at Moc Hoa. In the Fall semester, I will present a program on Vietnam, based on Karnow’s Vietnam, A History. I am going to devote one of the classes to the Advisory Role in Vietnam. If you guys could share some of your experiences, I sure would appreciate them.

      Take care and stay safe.


  69. I am Hal Singer was Lt Singer of Mat team 119 1970-1971 must have interacted withyou Scott would like to chat with you to see if we had contact or know the same people

    • Hal, Your response to Scott came to me for some reason. I think that you need to place your reply under something that Scott had sent. You had to have been in RVN during the Cambodian invasion. Did they jump off from Moc Hoa? They extended the airstrip to accommodate C-123s and C-130s, when I was there in 1968-1969. Great to hear from another Team 85 member. Why they call us 114 is beyond me. Take care and stay safe. Kevin

      • Yes I arrived to Tuyen Nhon District and immediately moved out to Cambodia just when we got up there the Big Red One was moving out. I have seen such a large scale withdrawal of a division that was in combat. All I can sy is that they did a magnificent job the area was relatively calm for some time. Yes the airstrip was busy with landings, I have seen many c-130 land on one wheel just for fun. Spent some time in bunkers at Moc Hoa before leaving to U.S.A.

    • Very nice to hear from you, Hal. I think Mat 119 was located downriver from us. I have it in my mind that team 119 suffered heavily from a VC attack around 1968-69. There was a PSDF that came to us with a US medal for heroism (Bronze I think) that was awarded to him at that battle. It is just a faint memory. I certainly knew of Team 119.

      I left from a very small outpost we built at Tri Phap in May 1970. My problem is that I have never run into anybody that I served with since nor have I heard from anybody. It leaves a large void. I seldom ever saw anybody but the MACV commander as we were always in the field like you must have been too. I just don’t remember the colonel’s name. I actually enjoyed serving there and didn’t want to leave my team. We were very young then

      Hope you are well and doing what you want by now. I may retire this Summer. It may be time for me to do things that I want as well. Time moves far to quickly. I’d be very glad to hear more from you. MAT team life was a special time for me.


  70. Scott,

    Thanks for writing back.

    Sorry to hear about your wife. MS is a tough disease. I hope that the medications are working.

    Sounds like you are a good father. I am sure that your daughters appreciate the help that you are giving them. I have a daughter and son. They both turned out well and make me feel the years as a parent of teens and young adults were very worthwhile, even though they did not feel worthwhile at the time..

    I know that it is tough with PTSD. We just spent a few days in Williamsburg, VA with a buddy and his wife. He was an ex chopper pilot. It is very strange that we have know each other for the last 30+ years and this was the first time we talked about our wartime experience. He also suffers with PTSD and he feels that some of the VA programs are helping him. I hope that you are connected to a good program. Even without PTSD, I have been a bitch to live with at times. My wife has been a great support.

    I am a big fan of 3M. I lived in the Twin Cities for 4 years and knew a number of people who worked for them. What are you selling now? Are you working for someone or are you a manufacturer’s rep.? I have been out of the workforce since 2006 for medical reasons. I still miss work. I have been lucky enough to pick up a volunteer teaching assignment with a Lifelong Learning Program for 50+ year old adults and I am enjoying the hell out of it. In addition to the teaching, I am taking a few courses too.

    Do you remember a guy named Durus (Beatle) Bailey. He was a Spec 5 supply guy from Moc Hoa and distributed supplies to the Teams at least once a week. he worked for me until late June, 1969 when I left country. He, then,extended for 6 months. I was wondering if his tour overlapped into yours. He contacted me in the 1990s. How he tracked me down, I really don’t know. He asked for help with his PTSD claim. I wrote a letter of support for his claim and the VA phone interviewed me. They eventually granted him a 100% PTSD related disability. We kept in contact until 2002/3.

    You are right about us having an entirely different life than guys who served in American units. Our experiences were entirely different from theirs. I think that we had the better of it.
    I realize that you had it much tougher than me. You were with a Team and were constantly in combat situations. Your living conditions sucked. We were in a compound and only had frequent mortar attacks on the compound. On the operations and ambushes I was on, I don’t remember ever having enemy contact. I really felt for the guys in the Teams. We did get a chance to interact with the Vietnamese and learn something about their culture. I really liked the Vietnamese (and still do), but disliked their leadership. Come to think of it, I was not really a fan of our leadership either.

    It is funny that hardly anyone knows where Kien Toung or Moc Hoa is, be they Vets or Vietnamese I have met since I have been home. I have a neighbor who was a pilot and flew the Caribou. When I first got to Moc Hoa, our airstrip was too short for C123s or C130s. We could only be supplied by choppers and smaller aircraft. He flew into Moc Hoa a few times on supply missions. They extended our field in January/February, 1969. I think that was in anticipation of the Cambodian invasion.

    Well Scott, being an old man, I had better have my warm milk and turn in. It’s 9 PM Eastern.

    Take care and keep positive.

  71. Scott,

    Thanks for the reply. You are right. I always have to try to remember where I was when I am welcomed home.

    That is great that your Dad is still alive. His combat experience seemed very tough. I had parked next to a WWII vet this afternoon. He had a silver star and a purple heart on his license plate. The WW2 vets are a strong and courageous breed.

    You are also so correct about a combat situation leaving a deep impression on vets. I was giving a class on Vietnam last Spring and tried to explain that even though Vietnam service was only 1%-2% of our lives(1/70 for me), it left more impressions and impacts on us than far longer time periods like college or work experience.

    Henry, the other poster from Team 85, was our hero because of his efforts to provide enough water for daily showers. I feel badly about mentioning it to you. You were probably able to only shower once a week or once a month.

    Did you go Reserves after you left active duty? As I told Henry, I was a conscientious objector against the Reserves. After I finished OCS, I knew I owed Uncle Sam 2 yrs. active duty, 2 yrs. active reserves and 2 yrs. inactive reserves. I felt that if they let the enlisted people out of their active reserve obligation when they came back from Nam, they really meant to let me out of the obligation when I came back. I ignore their letters assigning me to an active reserve unit and threatening to re-activate me into the regular Army.

    I am living in a 55+ community. We put together a veterans club about a year ago. There are 55 vets living here whose service ranges from WW II to the Gulf. The comradery is really outstanding, especially the guys who served in Vietnam.

    Are you still working or did you hang up the spikes?

    Do you know how this site started? I don’t know why we are Team 114 and not 85. I wanted to send a thank you to the person/group who put this together.

    Hope all is well with you.


    • Kevin,

      Glad to hear from you again. I am just now trying to understand my tour in VN. Until recently, I have tried not to dwell on any aspect of my time in KienTuong Province. I have never tried to reach out for team members either until I found this site. If I had stayed in the Army I might have eventually met up with some of the guys, but I got out too. I was afraid of a Reduction In Force and I knew that there were too many officers. Hindsight says I should have stayed.

      My plan was to go back to college on the GI Bill, but I discovered that my attention span was extremely short. I couldn’t read a page before my mind went someplace else. I was somewhat afraid of people and stayed to myself. Strangely though, I became a business to business salesman for 3M. It served me well and I advanced along for many years until one day I decided I didn’t want responsibilities anymore. I became a territorial salesman and now could work largely by myself. I have worked in Georgia, Oklahoma, Texas, Oregon, and now in Oklahoma again. I hope to retire but something always comes up. One daughter needs to pay off bills and move across the country and another needs a new heating and air system in her house. They are single which seems to cost me a lot. The wife has MS and her meds are keeping me working too. I’m not complaining. I have a nice home in a private cove on a decent lake. We are getting by much better than some for sure.

      Kevin, I looked at a Ranger site and saw the names of some friends that fell in RSVN and even in Grenada. Even with a PTSD disability, I feel very lucky and yet there are some feelings of guilt. I don’t understand why I would feel guilty for returning, but there is the feeling that I abandoned the team by leaving without them. Crazy, I know. I just didn’t want to go when the helicopter flew in to get me.

      Sorry to waste your time like this. I just seldom can talk with another vet and certainly not a MACV vet. I have two old friends that were with the 4th and the 25th Divisions. They saw plenty of combat but their missions were far different than ours. We never talk about our service time. They didn’t work with the Vietnamese at all and don’t appreciate them like we do.

      Stay well.


  72. McGrath, McGrath — were you the MACV Team 85 1st Lieutenant S-4 in charge of supply in Moc Hoa in 1968-1969?

    I can never forget faces, (even after people have aged), but names for me were always difficult.

    I stayed in the Army Reserves after Vietnam, total 29 years service, (in New Orleans), & retired as LTC. Went to about 28 two week summer camps in reserves all over the US, & 3 times Germany & I time Egypt. Everywhere I went I ran into Army people I remembered from somewhere.

    On our first 1980 trip to Germany, in the PX near Kaiserslautern, a Major Landry with us remarked, “OK Chauvin this is Germany — don’t tell me you know soldiers stationed in Germany.” I said Landry, see that guy with his back to us at the magazine rack, I know him — Landry & our commander Colonel Gensler said, “I want to see this shit!” — we approached — he was in uniform, I was in civies — I saw his name tag, (Fremont), & told him I knew him — he replied he did not know me — I told him we crossed paths before but I had to think — then it hit me — I said Vietnam — he responded, I remember, you speak French.

    When I first arrived in Vietnam they incorrectly sent me to MACV Team 84 at Cai-Lai, further south on the Cambodian border in Kien Phong Province, LTC Callahan, B-43 Special Forces Commander said he had not requested me & did not know what to do with me so he assigned me to then 1st LT Fremont as an Infantry Advisor to a District Vietnamese Company — Fremont was leaving in a few days & i would take his place — Fremont studied the Vietnamese language at Fort Benning; however, on the second day assigned to him he was asking me to explain our next day’s military mission to the 45 year old South Vietnamese Captain, (a former French Foreign Legion Commander) because he remarked that I communicated far better in French than he could in Vietnamese. Fremont left & I stayed with them.

    We went out on Infantry search & destroy missions every day except Sundays & got shot at every damn day walking though knee deep water — sometimes water was neck deep for me but over Vietnamese’s heads who had to swim with M-1 rifles — for some reason, I never got leeches but the Vietnamese would get them & had to pull them off about every 2 hours.

    One day when out on a mission we got mistaken for Viet-Cong & got bombed by the U. S. Airforce — just missed us — fire & smoke rose about 10 stories high — could not hear for about 2 days.

    Then later, the State Department in Moc Hoa called & said I was supposed to be assigned to them & would be transferred to Moc Hoa as Engineer Advisor — when I left, a black Special Forces Major told me because of serving as an Infantry Officer, & in actual combat on infantry missions, that he would put me in for a Combat Infantry Badge, (CIB) — never saw him again — never saw the (CIB) either.

    The Vietnamese Doctor at the Vietnamese Hospital in Moc Hoa was Dr. Manh — one American doctor, Dr. Goudelock & one Vietnamese doctor, Dr. Manh for about 40 American soldiers & about 44,000 Vietnamese civilians & soldiers in Kien Tuong Province further north — recently found Dr. Manh in France on the internet — wife & I stopped to see him in Paris last October, 2012 — he lives near Disneyland in Paris — wonderful reunion — most touching — he never learned English — I was his translator in the hospital after mortar attacks when we left Paris he commented: “C’est seulement Dieu qui peut faire cette reunion après quarante-trois ans!” — i.e., “Only God could have arranged for us to meet after 43 years.”

    If there was a Special Forces B-41/MACV Team 85 reunion for the time period 1968/1969 I think I would recognize everybody — these faces, expressions, smiles, never crashed in my memories — even remember Medic, Randy Shotwell putting on sunglasses to sing soul music in the bar at night, and the barmaid behind the B-41 bar, Co Lanh, who was part Cambodian.

    Have new e-mail address below:

  73. Henry,

    Thank you so much for telling me about your time there. What a wonderful memory you seem to have. I was team leader for MAT 114 in 1970. I hardly remember anything. I remember that it was a great experience. I was never assigned an assistant team leader and went on all operations with the team which consisted of 4 E-6’s. Yes, I was the junior guy according to the rest. I was a 1st Lt but you know how the sergeants are about officers. We all got along very well though. They were very professional.

    Since we used the Vam Co Tay so much, I was assigned 2 boats, a Ski Barge and a Boston Whaler. We built a machinegun mount on the bow of both because the river could be hairy. We worked with the Navy PBR unit a lot and they were our main support. Even the Sea Wolves and Black Ponies were there to shoot for us when needed. They were Navy aircraft.

    The Vietnamese Province Chief was Maj. Mahn. We had a prefab house setup in his compound but I rarely saw him as we were away from there so much. I don’t remember the Team 85 commander or his staff. I probably went to the team headquarters only a half dozen times. My last assignment was to assist an ARVN company as they conscripted locals to build an outpost at Tri Phap which had recently been a NVA training area. My team had been there several months when the helicopter arrived to take me out and brought my replacement, a captain. It seems that in a single day I went to Moc Hoa, caught an Air America flight to Can Tho and then a gunship to Saigon and a flight home. It all seems such a blurr now. I wish that I had taken a lot of pictures and had stayed in contact with the team. I don’t know what happened to my 3 interpreters either.

    I spent the next 2 years at Ft. Benning and then left the service. I didn’t like the garrison situation of stateside Army after Viet Nam. I taught advanced courses at the Infantry School as well as ran indirect fire training there. I wanted to go back to Viet Nam and actually didn’t want to leave there until our work was done. I have read that the troops in the delta held out well against the NVA and only surrendered after Saigon fell.

    Henry, only in the last couple of years have I tried hard to remember that time. So much has happened since that Viet Nam seems to have been a childhood event. The years have clouded so much and yet there are still the terrifying dreams that just never go away. Somehow I felt more alive then than since. Everyday was an adventure with high stakes.

    Again, thank you so much for your information.

    Scott Bogert

      • Kevin,

        Thank you for the welcome. The same to you back. Do you find it difficult when someone that isn’t a vet says “thank you for your service” ? I get emotional and don’t like hearing it except from a VN vet. ….just a sensitive spot I guess as nobody knows what it was like except those that went.

        I’m so glad that you and others made it back. I know many that didn’t as you possibly do too. My dad and I talked a little about the war this afternoon for the first time ever. He was a P-38 pilot in the Pacific and crashed in New Guinea. He was missing for awhile and spent another year flying fighters out of the Philippines. War affects every soldier no matter the deployment and the families waiting at home too. I have tons of respect for the boys going to the Middle East now. What a nasty place.

        Stay well


  74. I was a 1st Lieutenant Engineer Advisor from August 1968 – August 1969, assigned to Headquarters MACV Team 85, Moc Hoa, Kien Tuong Province.

    When I arrived in Moc Hoa, in August 1968, with the village having almost no water supply, American troops were taking showers once a week on Friday nights. The Vietnamese Water Plant was in the “red” for $10,000.00 — with unlimited funds from USAID I rebuilt the Moc Hoa water system in about a week with the help of (2) Vietnamese at the water treatment plant — we then had showers every night & an unlimited supply of water whereby for the first time in years, we filled the (2) water towers in Moc Hoa. .

    When I left Moc, the water system had over $10,000.00 in the bank.

    Vietnamese Province Chief was Colonel Ly Truong My — he escaped Vietnam in April 1975; however, his boat capsized & he & his family drowned in the South China Sea..

    Team 85 Headquarters was located in Special Forces Camp B-41, in an old French foreign Legion Compound built by the French, on Cong Hoa Boulevard, a few blocks south of the Vam Co Tay River. The Cambodian border was a little north of us across the Vam Co Tay River.

    When I left, the MACV Team 85 Commander was Lt. Col. Ernest P, Terrel, After I left Vietnam in August 1969, Team 85 moved south, near the airfield ,across Cong Hoa Boulevard in a new Team 85 Compound with new wood building,

    When I arrived, Special .Forces Commander was Lt. Col. Wesley Herrlein. He later got shot through the neck & survived an ambush south of Moc Hoa, & was med-evaced to CanTho.

    Lt. Col. Martin Beck replaced him & later went out in a helicopter to check out a secret air-dropped mine field along the Cambodian border — the helicopter got too close to an anti-tank mine, set off the mine & the helicopter exploded over the mine field — his body was not recovered at that time from the minefield.

    I worked directly for the USAID branch of the State Department under Foreign Officer 04 Mr. White, a State Department civilian.

    My counterpart was the then Kien Tuong Province Chief of Public Works, Vietnamese 2nt Lieutenant Do Dinh Phuc. Both of us were single at that time.

    Both of us spoke French fluently; hence, we had no communication problem, With Cochin China being a former French Colony, everyone in his office spoke French — all those born in the Cochin China part of South Vietnam prior to 1948 had dual French/Vietnamese citizenship. All Kien Tuong Province Vietnamese Officers in 1968-69 poke French fluently

    Being the first MACV Engineer Advisor, my counterpart immediately invited me to share his office after providing me with a desk.

    We wrote to one another from 1969 until he escaped in April 1975 & came to Orange County California with his wife & three (3) sons. He changed his name to Peter Do.

    Being a graduate of the University of Saigon as an engineer, he later received a Master’s Degree in Engineering at the University of California — two of his sons, Pat & Henry, (Henry named after me), are doctors.

    Peter died but we stay in touch with his wonderful wife & family — Peter always referred to me as his brother — they all became wonderful Americans.

    • Henry,

      It is great to see that you are still kicking around and have an outstanding memory.

      I heard from Duris Bailey in the early 2000s. He had been in contact with Terrell who retired in Kansas, I believe. I kept in contact with Bailey and helped him with his application for a PTSD disability rating. He lived in Oklahoma and died in 2006.

      Did you pursue a career in engineering.

      You came over as a 2nd LT. I think that you were the only person I outranked when you arrived,

      Kevin McGrath

  75. I was MAT 114 team leader working in Kien Tuong Province out of Moc Hoa in 1969 -1970. I wonder what happened to team members Strom, Pumphrey, and Chapman?

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